well Chad glad you got all that off your chest. Now last year was our first year at Tulsa and will be going there again next season at the bottom of the age group with both of my boys. I also do not want to be like Oklahoma but would rather beat Oklahoma when my sons are in Highschool. We do start early but havent played football yet as that starts next fall for us so yeah that might interfere. Football lasts how many months. Baseball lasts how many months. Wrestling lasts how many months thats the problem. I guess I also want to beat other states in other sports to. I also want my other kids to know that I am there for them to while they are traveling to Kc and Oklahoma City for Basketball, Volleyball and Track. Yes its hard to sit here and watch this topic because each of us are different and want different things. Guess maybe I will look into what I really want for all my kids and not just 1 or 2 as I have 5. yes thats my fault but wouldnt change a thing.

I agree there is plenty of competition right here in Kansas. The only times we left the state were for Big Horn, The Kickoff and Tulsa Nationals other than that my son found plenty of great competition right here in Kansas without a series. Looking at this years results from state my son wrestled 12 state placers 6 finalists and 2 state Champions and that is not counting multiple matches against some. If you are willing to move around in age and weight the tough kids are there waiting for you.

I fully understand that everyone is busy and some have multiply kids do other sports than wrestling. Just tell me how the seris will make Kansas wrestling better without taking away from the current triple crown award. I do not want to see an award that takes away from the FAMILIES that make GR/FS work for their kids who are trying for the current triple crown. If you explain that then I will let everyone else fight this out without my two cents.


Andrew Steele

why would it take away from the triple crown. your stuck on the name that i referred it to just to start the talk about the triple crown. Lance has stated several times that it doesnt have to be called the triple crown so thats been out for a while now. What takes away from the fs and gr triple crown is the fact that it doesnt involve as many kids as the folkstyle does and half the kids are off playing baseball. I support the idea of fs and gr but dont see anyway for me to fit it in right now. I do hope that in the future if they make some changes that i can get both my boys in fs and gr. the series idea was supposed to be about bringing all the best kids together but things just kept getting added and added. the biggest thing I see people talking about is the fact that we are adding just another award. That is just like adding the triple crown award. isnt that just another award.

How bout calling them what we always have, Tournaments, or even Open Tournaments. Triple crown, Trinity, Ultimate Dominator etc. are awards that are handed out to kids that make incredible accomplishments in this great sport. I can't see winning Park City, Salina & Hays in that same category. Most kids that win these prestigious titles will find little resistance at these very tough Kansas tournaments. There are exceptions to the rule but not many. WE play baseball on Tuesday & Thursday, wrestle on Thursday, Wednesday & Sunday & Xbox on Monday & Friday. Saturdays are for baseball games or freestyle/greco tournaments. I can't believe this topic has gotten 18 pages. WOW!! Hey, it's Monday, NOTHING going on, yard work & Xbox for the kids.

Kudos to you Patrick. you must want that wrestling dad of the year award. I will vote you in. I am going to say this. If the series was set up with the right tournaments it would be much tougher than the triple crown. The series champ would have all the best wrestlers included. The triple crown doesnt.

Oh by the way Patrick if you were to win that what do you want to win. You can choose from a big nice steak or a small old cheeseburger. Choose wisely cause i wouldnt want anyone thinking your just in it for the BLING!!! LOL

Patrick, this is an award for those who can't win the Triple Crown, Trinity, or Ultimate Dominator. If you can't win the Big ones make up an award you think your kid might be able to win. I'm going to get Winfield, Ark City and Central of Burden to make a series and call it the Cowley County Cup. Jake will feel a sense of Accomplishment and I will be a Proud Pop with a cool Trophy. I hope it will make him feel better for not winning the Trinity or Triple Crown this year.

jmo, but the triple crown is just what most people are complaining about. you mention the FAMILIES that make gr/fs work, and are trying for the triple crown.

i have heard that this proposal will be for those who can afford it,... isn't that the same?
i have heard that this proposal will be for trophy hunters............. isn't that the same?
i have heard that is won't be "the best" because not all kids will attentd.......... isn't that the same?
i have heard that you don't want anything to be taken away from any kid............. isn't that the same?
when not all kids do fs/gr doesn't the current triple crown take away from a kid who only does folkstyle?
i really don't know how to vote on this, but i do know that all of you keep saying the same things for both sides of the argument.
i think the kid that wins the classic, hays, and salina could very well contend for the current triple crown, does that take anything away from the kid who won all three of those?
we all want to be HA, but don't want to hurt any feelings at the same time? i just don't understand.

really i like the discussion, good points of view, and am just trying to play devil's advocate.

My son just picthed his triple crown jacket in the trash & put his tulsa nationals eagle on top of it. He is gearing up to go for the Cowley County Cup. Beeson your a genius.

Just to be perfectly clear, I have no problem hurting feelings. Especially if it hurts Kansas Wrestling.

We are not taking anything away from any kid...we are rewarding those who wrestle Freestyle and Greco.

Again, NO. It does not take anything away from them. It rewards those who wrestle Freestyle and Greco.

I hear ya.

I just want to say that in no may do I think a Ks series would ever compete with the Triple Crown or Trinity.
And Chad I look forward to supporting you and you Cowley County Cup!

If the best kids are NOT wrestling FS and GR, tell them to show up this summer and prove that they can beat the kids that are wrestling FS and GR, at FS and GR. It is easy to sit there and tell everyone that your kid could beat the kid that is FS and GR'ing, but to do it is another matter. .......it is a different beast, so show up and prove how versatile you are..............

I'm not badmouthing your kids playing baseball. My kid could hit a homerun EVERY AT BAT off of your kid, if my kid was playing. There we are even...........

Why don't you say who you are really directing this towards?
Cause it don't apply to all of us series freaks!
We tried freestyle! Didn't like the club so we have not been back.
We start wrestling before football is over and plan to practice thru the summer and attend camps! Even yours!
Have never complained about how long the season is!
Top or bottom we always go to Tulsa!
You tell me what other sacrifies you need me to make?



I dont want to be like them. I really like the series idea that they have and think we could use a form of it to promote wrestlng tournaments through out the whole state.



Chad
Our club has almost the exact same schedule as yours.
This year when we got to state there was 16 kids in our bracket and 10 of them we had never seen, 4 were D2 that we saw all year long and 2 we seen at Salina and Park City.
That tells me that we need to get out more!

Here was Jakes bracket:
Strait, Zachary Con-Kids
Dryden, Boo Boos` School
Bollinger, Derek East Kansas Wrestling
Perez, Kaj Greater Gold GC
Barnts, Austin Republic Co
Goans, Christopher Renegades
Page, Bryant Andover Jaguar
Green, Levi Trailhands Wrestling Club
Younger, Bryce Ellis
Withington, Tate Goodland
Hopkins, Triston Jr. Viking Wrestling Club
McGivney, Tanner Abilene Wrestling Club
Weber, Chase Brawlers
Priddy, Jordan Silver Lake Wrestling Club
Martin, Cole Hugoton

Now tell me honestly how many of these kids did Jake see THIS YEAR BEFORE STATE.

I am directing it to whoever it applies to. If you fall into that group, then yes, I am directing it towards you.


Then get out more. No one is stopping you.


Two of the kids from District 2 we did not see until Regionals, so I guess I don't see your point. Personally I don't want to wrestle the kids at State more than once or twice a year. We wrestle up in weight during the year. We did wrestle more than half of the kids in the 64lb. bracket.

You are wrong here!!! We are looking for it! I would say we are looking for it even more then others! And, the competition can be found! We are the ones trying to encourage the best/stronest brackets possible every few weeks!




Does this make you the same or worst then us "series guys"?

agreeing on about 75%, not bad.

i don't know that it would HURT ks wrestling as bad as you think, but i'm on board with it if that' what the majority would vote.

can't take anything away from anyone who has earned it. simply reward those who make sacrifices and wrestle fs/gr. OK down with that.

not OK to drive competition state wide and push our youth to challenge themselves in folkstyle by making sacrifices??? the series would not take anything away from anyone who wrestled fs/gr or any state champion, it would simply reward those who chose to seek out ks best competition, and those who happened to win.

but don't worry about my feelings they're not hurt, by any means. we just see things differently, diversity is a good thing. where i struggle is this. where are the suggestions on how to grow fs and gr, in ks?

look on the fs/gr forums there was a post from sek (maybe chanute) asking where to find fs in his area. the reply is from travis mcburney at santa fe trail. wow. i am not by any means trying to defend any series over fs/gr on developing ability. i'm just looking, seeing, and listening for ways to improve. thanks.

If that is true why did you see the same kids every week? I would definately say you were not looking for it more than others.




I don't think we wrestled anyone, even in D2 more than 3 times. We were looking for competition. Whether it meant wrestling up or going to Tulsa, USJOC, Kickoff, or Okie Tournaments before the season. You can do the same thing.

Bockman - I will concede that a series may not take away from the current Triple Crown but I would just like to know how a series would help (and I will rephrase the question) Kansas Folkstyle wrestling? Kids and Families that want to wrestle the best can now and the State Championship series is the prize at the end of the road. Why do we need to add more and more awards along the way?

Headup

have heard that this proposal will be for those who can afford it,... isn't that the same? NO it rewards kids who wrestle in the other two style and are also studs in Folkstyle.

i have heard that this proposal will be for trophy hunters............. isn't that the same? You are right unless the kid is wrestling during the summer to get better for next winter. I heard somewhere that summer wrestling make winter champions.

i have heard that is won't be "the best" because not all kids will attentd.......... isn't that the same? Last year my son wrestled two different state Champions in his bracket. Maybe all the best won't be there but there are some of the best doing it. If you want name PM me.

i have heard that you don't want anything to be taken away from any kid............. isn't that the same? The current triple crown rewards wrestler who wrestle year around not just Folkstyle. If a kids earns an award no don't take it away or create another one just to create one.

when not all kids do fs/gr doesn't the current triple crown take away from a kid who only does folkstyle? The only way it takes away from a kid that only does folkstyle is the kids who wrestle GR/FS may get more mat time and a chance to improve during the offseason.

Andrew Steele