Food for Thought --- Redshirt -- For real?

I was reading earlier this evening about the Reconstruction era (time after the civil war), and I came across the term red shirts. The red shirts were groups of people who used force to to scare white and blacks. Their purpose was to scare people from voting republican and to weaken the progression of the Black (African American) vote and civil rights. The red shirts worked inconjunction w/ the white-league and Kl-Klux-Klan.

I don't know the intent of the label "Red shirt" in college athletics, but I know that red shirt stood for segregation in the past. Now it's a play on words, knowledge (semantics). Should I be offended? Yes, I am. Red shirt - segregation of available active athletes from the inactive athletes.

How do you feel? It's a shame.

What's even worse is that some Black (African American) people were part of the red shirt movement in exchange for a high profile position......These people are called Clearence Thomas, Sell-Outs ect..... This goes to show, there are self promoting people in every race. We ALL love and hate. The biggest starter of hate is IGNORANCE.

Gaylen:

Am I offended - NO.

To be clear, all people, regardless of color of skin, have the ability to treat each other poorly. I have treated my brother and sister poorly, regardless of the color of their skin or the closeness of their proximity to my bloodline.

If you believe in the Bible, we are all brothers and sisters and are direct descendants of Adam and Eve, and the first mistreatment of one's brother came at the hand of Cain.

The history of slavery in the United States has been incorrectly taught in the public school system for YEARS.

The truth of the matter is the vast majority of slaves shipped to the United States were captured by rival tribesman in Africa and bartered for goods with the European traders.

Not too many years ago, and perhaps still today, in remote regions of Africa, Asia, and South America there are captured tribes serving as indentured servants to their captors.

This type of behavior has gone on for centuries, not just in our country. I believe the term used is "to the victor go the spoils".

While attending a state university and attending a minority studies class, my instructor, a large Native American, who openly displayed his hostility towards the White American, gave me an F on a research paper I had written regarding this very matter. I appealed the decision to the department chair, a black professor who had assisted me with my research, the department chair instructed my professor to review my subject matter for accuracy and to grade the research paper on the veracity of the topic, not his personal opinion. My appeal was upheld and the grade was changed.

The real victim of mistreatment in our country, by men of all skin color, is the "red man", the Native American Indian.

We will never be equal,till the goverment changes.Every time you have to put down on papper what color,creed,or sex you are for a job,you are not equal.In slavery days a way of life made us difrant.Now days the goverment makes us difrant.

I saw a shirt on a boy one day.He was about 14 years old.The shirt made a bold statment on race.I chated with the boy and he had the same thing on many peaces of papper one he gave to me.He said he was in a goup that wanted ALL people to be equal.This is what the shirt/papper said.

IRacist?
Am I racist?
You call me "Cracker", "Honkey", "Whitey" and you think it's OK.
But if I called you Kike, Towelhead, WOP, Sand-nigger, Camel Jockey, Gook, nigger or Chink you would call me a racist.
You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you, so why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?
You have the United Negro College Fund.
You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Black History Month.
You have Cesar Chavez Day.
You have Yom HashoahYou have Ma'uled Al-Nabi
You have the NAACP.
You have BET.
If we had WET(white entertainment television) ...we'd be racist.
If we had a White Pride Day... you would call us racist.
If we had white history month... we'd be racist.
If we had an organization for only whites to "advance" our lives... we'd be racist.
If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships...you know we'd be racist.
In the Million Man March, you believed that you were marching for your race and rights. If we marched for our race and rights...you would call us racist.
Did you know that some high school students decided to make a club for only the white students because the other ethnicities had them?... they all got sent to court for being racist but the african-american, latino, and asia clubs were not even questioned.
You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're not afraid to announce it. But if we announced our white pride, you would call us racists.
I am white.
I am proud.
But, you call me a racist.
Why is it that only whites can be racists?


One thing I should make clear.The boy with the shirt was not white.Only one out of the 5 boys was.


I hate to say it but we cant fix the past.Sad thing is we did not learn from it.

sorry about any spelling.

Is their some wrestlng connection I am missing hear?

The purpose I posted this comment on this thread is to bring awareness. I Gaylen C. Taylor take offense to the term "Red Shirt" now that I know what it stood for. I'm posting this because so many of US (All Races) refuse to have civil - mature conversation on topics such as these.

Mr. Salyer, you pointed out that Africans tribes sold the rights of other captured rival African tribes to the Europeans (whites). I understand that and I have never debated it. Every group of people at some point in history were captured and enslaved. This started back in the biblical days as you stated. However, I was speaking on the Reconstruction era (time after the civil war). Which the "redshirts" were purpose was to disenfranchise (take the vote) the black community and to dismantle the civil rights movement. Knowing this is disheartening, because the whites from the north (given the name of Carpetbaggers or scalawags (sp)) were discriminated against too. I understand that African American community would still be fighting slavery conditions if it were not for the abolishioners and many others.

I don't understand how a foul hurtful word could be used to describe OUR (everyone’s) student athletes. No matter the color (purple, white, red, black, orange, blue or pink). I feel like its making fun (joking) of the struggle people faced in the reconstruction era. Just as the fictional character JIM CROW did. That's why I'm offended.

Now I suggest that everyone goggle the WILLIE LYNCH LETTER - The Making of a Slave. This letter explains why the black community is still suffering. The Black family was broken down. The Black MANs four limbs were tied to a horse as his wife and child watched. The horse was beaten until the man was ripped apart. The strategy behind this was to make the Black Woman turn her male child (considered a wild beast - and a threat) over to the master. The Black Woman’s fear made her take the natural instincts of a man to protect away. The Black Woman was the new leader of the Black families, not the man. The Black woman became the spokes person to the master, never the man.

The native tongue, traditions and customs were stripped. The ability to read was forbidden. The differences of blacks were magnified (skin color, position on the plantation, texture of hair, men from women, men from boys, women from girls, age (young vs. old), material possessions, relationships,ect....
Willie Lynch Stated in 1712 that if the slave owners would follow his instructions, blacks (Negroes) would be enslaved for at least 300 years. (What year is it now? Has it been 300 years yet?)

We still see the effects of this today. Single women leading the family, uneducated & unequal education rights for everyone. The school districts receive funding based on the property taxes of the area. The ghettos (be advised more than black and Hispanics live in ghettos) property taxes are insufficient so, the education of those students attending those schools suffer too. It's not a black or Hispanic problem. It's a have and have not problem.

It's not my intention to be offensive or demeaning, I only gave my perspective.

Yes the wrestling connection is that we as fellow human being should be more aware of what is offensive to others. Sports is a big part of our lives. We will fill gyms together, ride in vehicles, coach w/ & against, compete with all types of different people. So, it would be in our best interest to try to get along w/ each other. We lose sight of this because WE all are guilty of not know what is offensive to each other at one time or another. I'm sure I'm opening myself up to critism. But, I felt compelled to speak on the subject matter. Hopefully the people who know me, understand.

Wow?! Really?! And why is Clarence Thomas a "Sell-Out"? Because he dares to be a Conservative Republican in the face of a micro-culture who are in lock-step with a overwhelming reverence for the rewriting of history (Civil Rights legislation of the 60's would have NEVER passed without Republican support, democrats...you know the party that "cares" soooo much about blacks, overwhelmingly was against the legislation) to suit the race hustlers content on keeping a great and wonderful people from realizing the American dream and intent on keeping racial politics a hot-button issue for eternity? I thought we were supposed to treat everyone the same regardless of what they look like?! "The content of their character, NOT the color of their skin"?! Right? or not?



Of this, we can agree for sure!

I humbly offer the following from a Great American with some TRULY great advice!
Morgan Freeman on Black/American History

According to Webster's Third New International Dictionary, Unabridged, the term "redshirt" is so called from the red jersey commonly worn by such a player in practice scrimmages against the regulars.

A list of the only words we should ever be offended by, IF they were true, would include:

Lazy
Liar
Hypocrit
Thief

We can be called every name in the book, but if they are NOT true of us, there is no reason to take offense.

THis is my 10 second list.....add your own........

I would offer a suggestion and two points of perspective on this topic.

The suggestion: this is a terrific conversation, but probably should be occurring in the "Other" section of the forum.

First Perspective: You might be over analyzing the term red shirt as it applies to athletics. I trust that you have researched the topic and the term red shirt would apply those individuals involved in political actions against republicans.

I hope to research it later, but it might be possible that the term is actually much more innocent than your conclusion. It may be possible that the first team to use or request an extra year of eligibility for athletes not yet suited for college ball, outfitted their ineligible athletes in red practice jerseys so that they could be easily identified on the field. It would be similiar to placing the Red Jersey on the QB indicating "stop, don't hit me during practice." (I just did a quick search and the one of the first known athletes to extend his eligibility was from the University of Nebraska and this might have a better correlation to the term "red shirt")

Second:
School district finance is based on property tax revenue. Lower socio-economic regions of a community generally generate less revenue from residential property tax, but receive higher revenues from the commercial/industrial properties in the area. The mitigating factor is that all revenue from local property tax is then placed in the public school system budgeting process. It is not disaggregated based on its source (ie. this money came from the NE side of town, so it has to go to the NE schools), it is distributed based on budgetary concerns and needs of the entire district.

A more recent infusion of the term red shirting, is now being used to apply to kindergarten children lacking the skills for kindergarten readiness based on the age and gender of the child. It is being used mostly for boys which mature later than girls. Five year old girls statistically demonstrate ready-ness, whereas young five year old boys are demonstrating a need to have an additional year of maturity to close the achievement gap. Thus the phrase "kindergarten red shirt" is gaining momentum. I have a feeling this is more of a link to the college use of the phrase, as opposed to a segregtory phrase from the 1700's. As with any educational issue, socio-economic issues also contribute to kindergarten-readiness, which invariablly switches to a conversation on race and culture.

Finally, what might be more interesting, is to look at the Republican (Blue States) and Democrats (Red States) connection with your political assertions. Is there a connection between the red state - red shirt?

I agree! Politics and/or religion should never be a part of one of the wrestling boards!

And who is the "master" these days? Government?! Which party/ideology keeps Black families from enjoying and participating in the American experience in full as they should and CAN? Its not the carefully cultivated scapegoat that Leftists (socialists, marxists, and modern-day democrats) have spent decades crafting! Nope, Conservatives have done and are attempting to continue the effort to take away the chains and restraints of government and free ALL Americans! Black are Americans too! Make the choice to be an American! Period, not a hyphenated one!



Again, what party/ideology refuses to let go of differences?
Despite what you hear them profess from time to time, Leftists(socialists, marxists, and modern-day democrats) are hell-bent on keeping differences at the forefront of popular culture! Must be nice to always have a built-in excuse!


This is ridiculous! Also illustrative! To quote a character in a popular movie several years ago, "Free your mind"! Fwiw, The character was a black man (NOT that it matters btw)!



Again, what party/ideology refuses to recognize families and Good family values and ridicules them at every turn? Yes, Leftists(socialists, marxists, and modern-day democrats) foment, agitate race issues constantly in order to keep these things separate and "unequal". Who/what ideology insists on grouping people? Referring to people by groups? by their race? Hmmmm?



This is pure Marxist ideology! Oh yeah, thaaaat's it! We're just not taxed enough! You keep raising taxes on producers in this country, you will end up making things worse for the people you profess to care so much about!

Agreed! THIS is the only one I am familiar with and the only one I recognize!

Far be it from me to belittle someones truly heart-felt offense to a term, but this "Redshirt" business just appears to be someone searching high and low for a reason/chance to be offended.

FREE YOUR MIND !!!

Can't argue with this! Somebody HAD to respond to the original post though!

Rough, what is your name? I feel that you have become angry. I love this country and this sport. KNOW THAT. I did not provide this information to start a race war or problems b/t you and I. I felt this information is important. Because it provides context to some of the arguments and struggles african americans face. I believe that the Willie Lynch Letter is true. You have the right to you own opinion. The letter helps give context to struggles some of the struggles. I became motivated when I read this letter. Hopefully, it will motivate someone else. (Not to hate, but understand. Not to give excuses, but to persevere)

I have my share of ups and downs, but I try to be a productive member of society, go to church, raise my children and pay taxes. What may surprise you, I even went to college. Have you heard of the Willie Lynch Letter before? Was it taught in schools? No. Did it make you mad after reading it? Well I was very angry, but I know what trap was laid. So, it's my responsibility to let everyone else know about it. So, they don't become trapped by circumstances.

So, do you disagree that a significant number of black families are in trouble, single females parents, many weak Men who are locked up and uneducated?

The government has a role to play. But, the people who affected the most are the HAVE NOTS apposes to blacks only.

Why do you believe that the Willie Lynch Letter is ridiculous?! Because your teacher never taught you about it? If that's ridiculous. What do you think about JIM CROW?

I'm not on welfare, I work, I help out in my community when possible and I take care of my children. So, who is using an excuse? I encourage everyone to educate themselves.



Rough, I can't raise taxes on anyone. The problem I have with taxes is that the #1 priority is not education. Producers in this country are Americans? Right? Then how do you justify sending job overseas? How do you justify seeing children on the street hungry? IN the riches country in the world.

True equality will be the day that every school district will qualify for the teaching, building, text books, lunch menu regardless of the community. (Ghetto or Suburbs) Is that "pure Marxist ideology"?! Or do you think the poor should try harder? If so? Where is your compassion?

By the way....I consider myself a conservative democrat. I believe the government should be a temporary crutch/help, not a home.

What is your agenda in your responses?

By the way, definitions change. Keep searching for the other meaning of "redshirt".

America was built on using competition to make things better. If Government would get out of education, and let the private sector handle it, schools would either get better, or go out of business.

No they didn't. And your reason for continuing to respond?

Knowledge of the redshirts or Red Shirts can be found at the address listed below plus a number of other places.

http://boballab.wordpress.com/2011/01/15/waving-the-bloody-shirt/

Sorry for wasting peoples time.

Gaylen Taylor

This is wild!! I don't want to get involved in the discussion at all, but I have to know what prompted you to post this in the "Kids Folkstyle" section of a Wrestling talk forum at 3:10AM??

Coach Doug, I agree that private school are great! But, what about the people who can't afford attend those schools? I don't wish everyone could attend one because research shows those students learn the curriculum very well.

I meant to say I wish everyone had the opportunity to attend a private school. Sorry.

That's why we either need the government to get out of education altogether, or offer vouchers to those that wish to send their kids to private schools........Of course they know that offering vouchers would cause the hallways of public schools to empty ( not all, but a whole boatload of them anyway), and would FORCE the government out of education. They want to continue to force people to depend on them for education, so they probably won't offer vouchers. Read today's paper about how vouchers helped Florida's education system.

When we have competition, it forces everyone to get better. Government has a monopoly on schools, but any other type of monopoly would be criminal. Ok for Uncle Sam to do it, but if you or I had the only say, WIDGETS, they would force us to split up, like they did the Phone company. But, as another example, the post office continues to sludge along in red ink, yet they won't turn over control of it to the private sector. The government does NOTHING better than the private sector, other than possibly National Defense, and if the private sector did that, it would be even better.........

I was reading about the subject. I also know that people on the wrestling forum have children planning to attend college someday and might have to "redshirt". That was my motive, nothing else. I normally stay off the computer, for reason as this. I never anticipated this much backlash. I continued, because I felt that I was being called a storyteller (liar).

I'll private e-mail you. Don't want to start another big fuss.

You are right Coach G. Clarence Thomas is a sell-out. His wifes group spent $550,000 in campaign monies from Liberty Central against Obama. This guy is supposed to be held in the highest regard of all the judges in US instead he makes a mockery of the position. His wife earnings are supposed to be reported on Federal withholding form now note, this is the same man that was incharge of the EEOC for the Federal Goverment before becoming a Supreme Justice said he and I quote 'inadvertently ommitted due to a misunderstanding" $686,589 in four years. Yea right same old BS. The money came from the Heritage Foundation a conservative policy group. Just like Clarence and Scalis drop by appearance at Charles Koch's political retreat. This is just what has come to light in the last five day's with Thomas. I can assure you it will not be the end to it. Judge Thomas and Judge Scalia should have never been at this politcal retreat. Why? Because they are to remain free of influence. What a laugh!! I am niether offended or disilusioned. Merely disgusted with it all!! Footnote: for any and all of this information referenced New York Times Tuesday 25,2011 pg. A16

For a conservative voice of a black man, I highly recommend Herman Cain, Walter Williams, and JC Watts. I would vote for any and all of these guys for president. There are plenty others out there as well. They believe that government is the problem, not the solution, to our country's woes.............

YES, they did sporto! Leftists AND their sympathizers will ALWAYS be responded to by THIS American!

Thomas Sowell is also a very respected and good Conservative (ie. Good American).

Although tempting to respond to this idiocy, I'll simply say that this is from the same mindset that feels that Conservative ideology has no right, no Constitutional guarantee of free speech. You see to Leftists (socialists, Marxists, Alinskyites, Sorosians, and obamunists), Conservatives have no right to hold an opinion, let alone express it. To Leftists, Conservatives are to keep quiet, and have hands firmly gripped around their ankles. Yes, Leftists are the ones who have all the right answers, yes THEY are the most compassionate, THEY care more than you or I, THEY are not to be questioned!

Leftists believe in free speech also, as long as what you are speaking doesn't conflict with what they are saying........

Gaylen:

Research the following link in order to free your mind!

National Black Republican Association

The only stupid act is that Thomas actually would think someone would buy into his explantion. I am not a Lefist,merely a taxpaying American that is sick of the abuses of power at all levels of goverment. If I was to label myself I would be closer to conservatives than the other parties. I feel everyone has a right to free speech. Just do not insult my intelligence with your Bullsh. The fact that some people make an assumption of a person's position by reading what has already been confirmed By Thomas himself. If you are a US Supreme Justice you have a duty and obligation to the people and the goverment to steer clear of issues and groups with their own agendas. Here in lies the problem there is no formal mechanism for conflict of interest's with Justices at this level.

Gaylen your a good man. Race can be a touchy subjects. Definitely made for an interesting conversation.