Why don't we all be honest about what is really going on here...

There are a group of folks that want the kids season to end earlier and they want to work towards some form of a high school aged Grand State.

You can't get there from here if high schoolers are involved in the kids state series. So the first step was eliminate the 16U division and create a high school division.
The second step was to create a USAWKS sanctioned 6U state.

The following steps have yet to come to fruition. If we can create a bylaw to not allow hs wrestlers to wrestle 14U then it becomes easier to create a separate kids state series that could include the 6U but not high schoolers.
After that it becomes easier to create a USAWKS sponsored grand state for high schoolers a week or so after high school states.

Will if I missed anything please fill in the mistakes.
I only bring this up becauseI can't believe that a few of the people I know and respect feel so strong and react so emotionally to this 14U/HS debate. Also, I find it pretty offensive when I hear these folks making blanket statements about kid ducking competition and running.

I do agree with Beeson.....I don't think this will pass if it is brought to the state body....AGAIN!
Shawn Budke

The easy solution to get 14 yr old HS kids out of the kids series is to change the age divisions to grades.
Kindergarten and Under (6U)
1st - 2nd grade (8U)
3rd - 4th grade (10U)
5th - 6th grade (12U)
7th - 8th grade (14U)
9th - 12th (HS)
Problem solved.

Sounds good, but what about red-shirted kids, 15 year old that is an 8th grader, where would he fall? The 7th and 8th grade division? The way it is now, this would be High School no questions asked. This plan would cause more problems.

I don't see a problem that needs to be solved.

Why don't we all be honest about what is really going on here...

There are a group of folks that want the kids season to end earlier and they want to work towards some form of a high school aged Grand State. THAT WAS NEVER A GOAL. HS WAS ADDED TO ALLOW MORE HS KIDS AN OPPORTUNITY TO EXTEND THEIR SEASON. THE STATE PLACERS WERE NEVER EXPECTED TO FLOCK TO THE SERIES.
You can't get there from here if high schoolers are involved in the kids state series. So the first step was eliminate the 16U division and create a high school division. THIS WAS DONE BECAUSE WE SIMPLY DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH ROOM TO ADD AN AGE GROUP. ALSO, THE NUMBERS WERE PITIFUL FOR 16U. WE DON'T EVEN NEED TO HAVE SUBS FOR HS BECAUSE THE NUMBERS ARE LOW AND THEY ARE THE LEADING AGE GROUP FOR SCRATCHES AT SUBS.

The second step was to create a USAWKS sanctioned 6U state. IT WAS TESTED SUCCESSFULLY THIS YEAR. WE LIKE KEEPING THEM ALONE BUT THE LOGICAL STEP WOULD BE TO ADD 8U AND 10U AND HAVE THAT AS A THREE WEEKEND SERIES THAT ENDS THE SAME WEEKEND AS HS STATE. THIS GIVES THESE GROUPS TIME TO ENJOY SPRING BREAK, DO OTHER SPORTS, OR CONTINUE IN THE NATIONAL EVENTS IF THEY SO DESIRE. WE ONLY ATTRACT ABOUT 45% OF OUR CARD BUYERS TO THE STATE SERIES AND WE NEED THIS PERCENTAGE TO BE HIGHER.

The following steps have yet to come to fruition. If we can create a bylaw to not allow hs wrestlers to wrestle 14U then it becomes easier to create a separate kids state series that could include the 6U but not high schoolers.
After that it becomes easier to create a USAWKS sponsored grand state for high schoolers a week or so after high school states.

THAT SEEMS TO MAKE SENSE BUT THE REAL ARGUMENT IS THAT THE MAJORITY OF 7TH AND 8TH GRADERS ARE NOT PREPARED TO WRESTLE HS WRESTLERS YET AND THE HS WRESTLERS HAVE A STATE TOURNAMENT ALREADY. SO IF YOU WANT TO ARGUE THAT SO DO THE MS WRESTLERS THEN WE COULD DO THIS. 6U, 8U, 10U, MS AND HS. CALL IT GOOD.

Will if I missed anything please fill in the mistakes.
I only bring this up becauseI can't believe that a few of the people I know and respect feel so strong and react so emotionally to this 14U/HS debate. Also, I find it pretty offensive when I hear these folks making blanket statements about kid ducking competition and running. IF YOU ARE A HS WRESTLER AND YOU CHOOSE 14U ARE YOU DOING IT BECAUSE IT IS MORE CHALLENGING? GIVE ME A BREAK SHAWN. THERE IS ONLY ONE REASON, TO HAVE AN ADVANTAGE.

I do agree with Beeson.....I don't think this will pass if it is brought to the state body....AGAIN! EVENTUALLY IT WILL. CHANGE IS A SLOW PROCESS. MOST CAN BE EDUCATED AND THOSE WHO CAN'T WILL FALL BEHIND.
Shawn Budke

Will,

Your right there is no debate. It was voted on and your position did not pass!


What are you arguing for? In one post you want the HS Elite to take a break in another you say they aren't getting better by wrestling 14 and Under. How would they get better by taking a break. Did every kid that was successful in the past follow your plan?

Those that want to wrestle HS can, those that want to get better can, those that do not want to getter better can chose not to! Remember this is a free country!

I am against anyone being punished for their success! I am all for change to make the sport better. I do not feel that making rules that limit what one can and cannot due based on their success or failure make anyone better!

Last but not least I have the choice to not agree with you!

Zach Campbell

I didn't recommend the elite take a break.

7th and 8th graders should not be punished for their inability to have four months of HS practice and competition with a professional coaching staff. 8th graders don't have an opportunity to compete for a HS state championship. This is if for them. Honestly, this is going to seem harsh but your comment that I am trying to punish wrestlers because of their success is about the dumbest comment I have seen on this forum. Sorry, just calling it like I see it. They get two shots at winning a state title in Folkstyle and way better preparation. We are punishing the 7th and 8th graders by letting the HS kids move DOWN to wrestle them. I understand your interpretation but the rule to eliminate state placers was a compromise. I don't feel that ANY HS wrestlers should be allowed to wrestle 14U.

Both State Tournaments may be going on, but those who got beat out or were not on varsity will still be wrestling in the Kids State Tournaments.

Both of these examples won't help you out Tracy. They have their state tournaments while HS is still wrestling. You won't find wrestlers



Sent from my iPhone in both. Sorry. Some of the 7th and 8th will be subject to elimination from encountering a HS wrestler therefore not getting three more weeks.

Show us the data. Names and teams. I don't think you are correct.