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Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: sportsfan02] #174044
10/30/10 10:56 AM
10/30/10 10:56 AM
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ReDPloyd Offline
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Originally Posted By: sportsfan02
Originally Posted By: smokeycabin
I will present some of the data to the state body,

Please tell me you aren't presenting any of this crap from the floor of the meeting? This is exactly why people don't show up for the meeting, is silly stuff like you have been posting here! People have the information it's time to vote, up or down.


I am not sure of your credentials, but I am sure of Sean's credentials. I have known him for about seven years, but it only took the first year to know that he cared a great deal about Kid's wrestling and cared about the kids. I wanted to go on and say that I have read enough of your "crap" over the last few years, but I won't.


Lee Girard
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: BLT] #174046
10/30/10 11:05 AM
10/30/10 11:05 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 271
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wrestlingmom Offline
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Originally Posted By: BLT
Ohhh Smokey...
When this thing passes what will you do with all that time you will have on your hands from not having to dig up all this info that 90% of the people who read this thread pay no attention to?


I can tell you what he will be doing with his time. Running STA wrestling practice 3 nights a week from 6:00 to 8:30 (encompassing both open and novice practice), spending every Saturday and Sunday at kids wrestling tournaments, after tournaments he will likely be spotted at high school tournaments all over the JoCo area watching wrestlers who he has coached since they were 6. Once in a while, if his schedule permits he may be able to sneak in a trip to watch his own son wrestle for West Point. But before he leaves he will obsess about making sure that his club practices are being handled by competent coaches, especially the novice practice.

So don't worry about Sean.


Sharon Henes
STA Wrestling - President Emeritus!
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: sportsfan02] #174047
10/30/10 11:15 AM
10/30/10 11:15 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,963
Shawnee Kansas
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smokeycabin Offline OP
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sportsfan02 - I thought that is what the state body meeting was for - presenting the facts. I wanted to know some information about the proposal and I was told by SFGD good luck get it yourself and I did.


Both states have a state championship series that starts at 8 & U


Between 2005-2010 - USA Wrestling Participants
Missouri Growth rates by age group

Percentage change &
Actual Number gain/loss
Participant/Card Holders
10 & Under 43.44% 887
11-14 22.69% 481
15-18 15.55% 167


Between 2005-2010
Wisconsin Growth rates by age group

Percentage change &
Actual Number gain/loss
Participant/Card Holders
10 & Under 41.56% 1,113
11-14 15.13% 426
15-18 33.61% 406

Between 2005-2010
Kansas Growth rates by age group

Percentage change &
Actual Number gain/loss
Participant/Card Holders
10 & Under 27.00% 969
11-14 11.83 305
15-18 6.04% 89

Source: USA Wrestling

From a business stand point the above states are a couple of models our state board and state body/organization might want to check and see what they are doing.

Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: smokeycabin] #174051
10/30/10 12:59 PM
10/30/10 12:59 PM
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Kansas
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sportsfan02 Offline
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Kansas
Originally Posted By: smokeycabin
sportsfan02 - I thought that is what the state body meeting was for - presenting the facts.

You have presented NO facts! You have presented a bunch of numbers which have no meaning one way or another. Facts would be what those numbers prove if anything. Again, they PROVE NOTHING and to your credit you haven't attempted to say they do. They are JUST numbers and the facts would be those deduced from those numbers. If you want to provide handouts at the beginning of the meeting for all to read I have no problem with that but to get up and present these numbers again is a waste of everyone's time. There is no need for a bunch of debate on this issue as it has been hashed and rehashed over and over for years. It's time to vote!


Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: ReDPloyd] #174052
10/30/10 01:02 PM
10/30/10 01:02 PM
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Kansas
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sportsfan02 Offline
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Originally Posted By: ReDPloyd
I am not sure of your credentials, but I am sure of Sean's credentials. I have known him for about seven years, but it only took the first year to know that he cared a great deal about Kid's wrestling and cared about the kids. I wanted to go on and say that I have read enough of your "crap" over the last few years, but I won't.

So anyone who recognizes the "data" he has posted here as crap doesn't care about kids?


Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: sportsfan02] #174056
10/30/10 01:47 PM
10/30/10 01:47 PM
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ReDPloyd Offline
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ReDPloyd  Offline
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Originally Posted By: sportsfan02
Originally Posted By: ReDPloyd
I am not sure of your credentials, but I am sure of Sean's credentials. I have known him for about seven years, but it only took the first year to know that he cared a great deal about Kid's wrestling and cared about the kids. I wanted to go on and say that I have read enough of your "crap" over the last few years, but I won't.

So anyone who recognizes the "data" he has posted here as crap doesn't care about kids?

You said it, not me. I just said that Sean is a great guy, an excellent coach, a caring father, and someone who devotes a "crap" load of his time trying to make wrestling in Kansas better.


Lee Girard
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: ReDPloyd] #174057
10/30/10 02:07 PM
10/30/10 02:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 9,762
Matside
Chief Renegade Offline
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Agree or not with Sean, anyone who knows him understands his passion for helping kids.


Eric Johnson

www.scienceprovesit.com

Acts 4:12


Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: Chief Renegade] #174066
10/30/10 04:39 PM
10/30/10 04:39 PM
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ReDPloyd Offline
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Originally Posted By: Chief Renegade
Agree or not with Sean, anyone who knows him understands his passion for helping kids.

Thanks Chief. His passion for the sport is on one level, his understanding for the sport is on another level. When it comes down to it, it is always about the kids. If they ever have a Kansas Kid's Coach's Hall Of Fame, I would vote him in on the first ballot.


Lee Girard
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: ReDPloyd] #174074
10/30/10 09:36 PM
10/30/10 09:36 PM
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Posts: 75
qttawa, ks.
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creach boys Offline
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qttawa, ks.
I hope that if the the 6 and under passes that it will be handled as well as Rick has. I also hope that as a compromise you don't stop all of the 6 year olds from wrestleing up. My 7year olds birthday is 19 days after the cut off. So he will be in 6 and under and has looked forward to wrestling up this year in the big show like his big brother. As with him not all six year olds should be held back as some are more advanced than others. The ones thar are will be there the ones that are not will not be there as it has always been. Why not leave that part alone? Not all kids are the same, why judge them all the same?

Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: creach boys] #174075
10/30/10 10:09 PM
10/30/10 10:09 PM
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ReDPloyd Offline
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I would agree with you creach boys. Some U6 are very gifted and have the ability to wrestle up to the next age group. I still don't think that there are enough in all weight classes to warrant a U6 State series of tournaments. The wrestlers that are that gifted, should be given the opportunity to wrestle for some U8 hardware at State.


Lee Girard
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: ReDPloyd] #174085
10/31/10 02:11 AM
10/31/10 02:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 400
SEK
in it to win it Offline
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SEK
The proposal prohibits 6 year olds to wrestle in an age group above their actual age. This will halt 6 & U that 'maybe can' do it UNABLE to compete if they are wrestling 8 U participating in Topeka.

5 & 6 year olds don't need the memory of anxiety, fright & frustration. With only their coach in their corner we're losing that important nurturing; intimacy of consoling the child after such a big event's loss while the parents sitting in the stand at this age of 5 & 6 are doing all they can to "be there". Financially it doesn't make sense especially counting on 80 5 & 6 year olds that weigh 80 lb's or more. Making the kids grow up & be competitive at such a young age when psychologicaly most have not matured -- is NOT the answer. The children are Preschooler's, Kindergartners & 1st graders! They have years to acquire competition mentality physically as well as emotionally. This is what the compilation of Sean's literature illustrates for the informed reader.

Nothing is wrong with the Ottawa Tournament -- all that desire to go---go. The bracket if your child is in the median wt range may be larger. But to have a qualifier and a State series for kids this age takes the fun out of the tournament (It truly will be hard to believe that this will be unseeded--whereas the State series gets pretty detailed in this regard). The Novice Championships are also a great idea for children this young. Everyone goes, everyone wrestles.

To have a kid believe they've reached the pinnacle in a sport such as wrestling at 5 or 6 years old consequently may only substantiate withdrawal from the entire sport in time.

The data speak for itself in terms of reflective growth. If you're not willing to analyze and review the data then maybe it does need to be presented because those are the FACTS compiled from USA Wrestling & Sean has done a great review of States and their 6 U offerings. It will be exciting to track & tend how we do grow as a State in Wrestling. We have great wrestlers! No doubt about it. Let's just keep them on the mat.

The Vote should be NO on this proposal. Allow the 6 U to compete in the 8 U State tournament like they have been. J.M.H.O.


In it to win it.
Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: in it to win it] #174097
10/31/10 11:58 AM
10/31/10 11:58 AM
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BLT Offline
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I am not (nor will I ever) questioning Smokeys commitment or passion to the sport. I was just stating how much time he has spent looking up all these facts that have probably made very little impact on the people that read this thread.

Re: Just SAY NO to 6 & Under State Championship [Re: BLT] #174116
10/31/10 08:12 PM
10/31/10 08:12 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 123
Haysville
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hartley5 Offline
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I am very disappointed this proposal did not pass. The 6 and under kids pay their dues like every other age group and should be rewarded accordingly. I think the 6u would benefit from a shortened season. I still think holding an "unofficial" 6u state tournament the Sunday after high school state is a great idea.

-Sarah Hartley


Ryan Hartley
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