Toughest Tourny

What is the toughest tourney?

How about the Hays Prarie Classic

the salina south tournament was tough.

Having wrestled in both, Newton is MUCH tougher.

How about the 321A state tournament?

Some interesting news from the Bobcat Classic:I went back and tracked the last seven matches in each weight class (final eight wrestlers in each class) to see how big a factor competition had
to do with the tournament running longer than previous years. The last 98 matches featured 14 overtimes, 21 matches decided by one point, and 17
matches decided by 2 Pts (58 of the 98 matches).
There were only 11 falls! The competition was fantastic and I want to personally commend all of
the wrestlers and coaches that participated in this year's meet. You did a super job and provided
fans with some great wrestling! Next year we will
leave four mats out longer on Saturday to ensure
that we stay on time. Good luck the rest of the year and thanks again.

How about either of the Wester Kansas Regionals (3-2-1A or 4A)? I think those would rank up there pretty high as well!

BELOIT !!

I can believe that the 3-2-1a regional is pretty tough, but come on, guys! The 4a regional may be somewhat tougher than it is out in Eastern Kansas, but it's not like we're leaving any potential state placers behind (maybe in the 3-2-1a regionals, but definatley not in 4a).

If we're gonna say state tournaments, 4a is the toughest...

there ya go thinking 4a is all that.

And I suppose you're going to tell me that 5a is tougher? Puh-Leeze!

When picking the toughest tournament you can save your breath on the state tournaments. They are not the toughest tournaments in the state. Not in a state that has events the likes of the Bob Cat Classic and Newton. Even the Derby tournament at one point in time was more competitive than any of the state meets.

My own preferance of tough tournaments would be the Bob Cat Classic. There you have state champions from all classifications, and even from one of the top teams in Iowa all scrambling just to place.

Beloit, Salina South, and Hays are all good tournaments, but are to small to go toe to toe with even the state tournaments. Believe me they do not compare with the Bob Cat Classic or Newton.

Time Stands Still

How bout the Garden City Invitational?....because after all it is a nationally ranked tournament!

In most cases 4A state champions wouldn't stand a chance against the 321A state champ.

I'd like to know the logic behind that statement

This may be a little off subject, but when has that ever stopped us ;-) My question is this ...what weight class is going to be the toughest at regionals? Anybody have access to info on returning medalist in each weight? Last year 321a 125 lbs at Norton was insane. Yonkin, Baker, Loyd and Black made it out alive. This year there are 4 returning medalist at that weight in the Trego regional and I can think of 3 medalist at 119 that will be in the Trego Regional. others?

Hays Prarie Classic

If you take top to bottom, I think maybe
Newton was tougher than Bobcat. If you take the toughest finals, Garden City with El Reno, Ok. and Ponderosa (denver Colo.) Not to mention Chapparal (Colo) made the top 2 and in some cases 3 places the toughest. Highlight was 135 class with the no. 3 and 6 ranked wrestlers nationally competing in a very well wrestled match with no conservative measures on the part of either wrestler. They made it very clear that they had come to wrestle and by golly they went at it! Ponderosa and El Reno travel all over the country to wrestle and I believe that either would have been capable of winning any other tournament in Ks. that they attended. It was too bad that the rest of the lineup was not up to the level that the top 2 or three participants were. As far as the regional and state tourneys go, there are getting to be so many high quality individuals out there that about any regional or state is going to be very tough. 125 in 321 and 160 in 4a look tough to me.

Hays Prarie Classic is pitiful

That is simply a false statement.

You're telling me for instance a few cases i can think of off the top of my head.....

Taplin couldn't win?
Grater couldn't win?
Bahe couldn't win?

lets be serious now....i think those 3 could easily hold their own, with anyone in any class

alex

I'm not saying they couldn't win, but I'm also not saying that they couldn't lose. jb83 is talking like the 4a STATE CHAMPIONS would get teched in the first period, and all I'm saying is that it would be a tough match.

And don't you think there would be a chance they could lose?

There's always a chance for a guy to lose, it's just the nature of the sport, i was actually agreeing w/ you and stating to jb83 that he was wrong in his assumption, but you never know in wrestling, who's better on any given day

alex

Oh, I'm not too familiar with the names... my bad!

That was a idiotic comment for sure. There are guys that aren't even state champions in 4a that beat 3a state champions all the time. I don't think I really need to list them cause it would take all day to write them out. 3A is tough all around that much is given, but what was quoted above is simply not true

False poll without Garden City Invite included

Nigel your an idiot

That was a idiotic comment for sure. There are guys that aren't even state champions in 4a that beat 3a state champions all the time. I don't think I really need to list them cause it would take all day to write them out.

Go ahead Nigel- list them, or your comment may be the most idiotic statement on this post. If there are so many it shouldn't take all day to come up with 10 or so.

I'd have to say that they top 2 of each weight from 321a and 4a are probably comparable up and down the line. The difference is, I believe, that in most weights in 4a you could wrestle the state tournament 5 times and have 5 different outcomes.
To say that one class is much farther ahead of another is a little far-fetched.

I would like to see the reasoning behind your statement. By calling this tournament pitiful...you are calling me pitiful as well. How bout Baldridge and Cornejo or Younkin or ST. Francis as a team? Are they all pitiful as well Wrestler06. No doubt in my mind that Newton is probably the toughest tournament but you should probably try the whole thinking before typing thing. I guarantee Hays Prairie Classis was NOT pitiful my friend.

why was the GCHS invite not on there???? it was ranked the 27th hardest tournoment in the nation!!!!!!!! honestley what tournoment could top that????????

except for the 26 tournoments ranked ahead of it of course just had to put that coment in there so no one would be a smart alek about it

the hays prarie is far from pitiful. younkin took 5th his junior year and then went on to win state

but compared to completely stacked tourneys such as newton and bobcat, hays prairie is second rate.

This is not a tournament, but if it was, the Ark Valley Chisolm Trail League tournament would definitely be one of the toughest. I really wish it was a tournament. It would be fun to wrestle in.

Did you just bring up a fictional tournament in an argument about the toughest tournaments in the state?

Nice.

I am here for your entertainment.

Two teams don't make a tournament? Who else is there?

Chapparal (Denver), Canyon City (Colo) Lamar (Colo), Amarillo (Texas), and El Reno (Ok) made the guys from Scott City, Andale, Derby, Garden City, Ulysess, and several other Kansas schools work pretty hard to medal. Several wrestlers in each bracket had very impressive records, and while the first round or two had some very one sided matches, that is usually true of any tournament. I think if you could combine the top 4 from Bobcat, Newton, Garden, and one or two of the other outstanding competitions in the state, Garden would have more placers and score more points. Easy to say, since it won't happen, and strictly my opinion. Some of the guys that went to Newton or Bobcat or Hays or Beliot feel differently, I am sure.

This is not a knock against the Garden tourny since I have wrestled in and coached at it, and I think its one of the toughest in the state and often forgotten about, but I was impressed at how tough Basehor was this year. At the Garden Inv. Garden City was 8th as a team at Basehor they were 9th. Andale was 6th at Garden and placed 13th as a team at Basehor. Interesting? The top teams at Garden would be hard to beat. I would love to see how Oak Park Mo. would match up with El Reno or Ponderosa. I think the depth of good teams at Basehor is what made it so tough this year.

I think that the question that determines toughest tournament is whether you intend to win it or finish third or below. Garden City was definitely the toughest tournament to win in Kansas this year, and likely to finish second, although I would think two or three teams from the other tourneys might be able to run at Ponderasa. Not El Reno, though. That is why I would call Garden the hardest.

Oak Park, Mo who was at Baldwin was better than any team at Basehor, Newton, or Beloit. Simply put with 2 national champions and 4 other all americans, a 60 pounder that majored travis eden. and a hurt 71 and 89 pounder. they would honestly show up any team in KS right now. Not to degrade any of the good programs in KS but they are incredible.

Umm. The 321A championship is way tougher than 4A. Their is some weights that 4A is tougher but most of the weights c'mon their is no chance for the 4A guys. Look at what Plattnerr did to Marrs in the finals at Beliot. I lost to Plattner 5-2 and it was a good match. Marrs just got handled. Some other wrestler you might of heard of Sprigg, Madden, Baker, Younkin, and Maybe Kingsbury. Yeah all good wrestlers. That could and would easily win their weights and also beat the #1 4A kid in the state. ALso guess what, their all from the western part of kanasas. Which yes the west is way harder than the east.

Someone is blinded.

Computerized Shoes aka Andrew Gossett (Buhler 152)
I believe that Spencer Burns (Cimarron 1-2-3A) whipped you at the Scott City Tournament. Also Cimarron is West of Buhler. Come back sometime

Aren't you old dalefish1? How come you're talking trash to a kid?

Get a hobby.

Pulec you are nutz. Do you think some of the teams out west can compete with the likes of Abilene,Clay Center, Manhattan, Turner, SFT, Silver Lake? Here is a good example, the Bashor-Linwood Bobcat this year Top 15 teams

Turner (Turn) 171.5 - East Kansas
Glenwood (Glen) 166 - Not From Kansas
Abilene (Abil) 153.5 - East Kansas
Goodland (Good) 143.5 - West Kansas
Santa Fe Trail (SFT) 138 - East Kansas
St. Thomas Aquinas (STA) 131.5
Silver Lake (SL) 126.5 - East Kansas
Blue Valley (BV) 121.5 - East Kansas
Garden City (GC) 119 - West Kansas
Columbus (Col) 118 - East Kansas
Shawnee Heights (SHght) 103 - East Kansas
Paola (Paola) 96.5 - East Kansas
Andale (And) 93 - West Kansas
Fort Scott (FS) 82 - East Kansas
Junction City (JC) 73 - East Kansas

10 out of thoese 15 are from strictly east kansas, and I granted you the witchita area schools as a favor cause they could be considered on either side. Would you care to revise your statement? True Norton and Hoxie weren't there, but you are talking about two teams out of countless ones that reside on the "west" side of Kansas.

MancerL:

I will admit that I’m almost as old as dirt, but why is stating the truth “talking trash to a kid”?
Please!!

I believe Spence has "whipped" all opponents this year.

I had the pleasure of watching Spence at the Liberal Tournament, and there is no shame in losing a match to this outstanding athlete.

However, he is a 321a guy from Western Kansas. It always seems like the talk of "who's who" comes down to east and west, and this year I am going to look outside the box and say that the East guys taken across the board may be the superior guys-- so far they haven't all decided to go to a private school, so they are on different teams. Norton appears to me to be the superior team, but its pretty hard to discount the efforts of Turner High School. By using the Bashor scores to prove a point is really not a very good test, since only 2 really far west teams competed, which is like ten per cent of the competition, against many of the best eastern teams extant. Add Norton, St. Francis, Oakley into the mix and you would have a bit different score. Same holds true for Garden City, No eastern schools except for Bashor chose to make the trip, due to budget, time, travel fatigue, etc. Goodland made the effort, wrestled with that problem, and did well. Newton was a good test because of their central location, and it was a very good test. Norton came out on top there, and earned it, but very close competition resulted. That to me shows how close it really is between the classes and the sides of the state, and even though I am a western fan, I think this year both sides and all three classes have a legitimate argument, because all have good individuals, and the team argument is just crazy between about 5 or 6 schools!

Being at both tournaments I would say that Garden City and Basehor tournaments are dead even in difficulty of competition.
This is my opinion, not fact, just opinion. Basehor's competition may be a little deeper in the area of tough preliminary matches, but Garden City's competition is much tougher when you get into the semi finals. The teams at Basehor are very good and I wouldn't take anything away from them, but after seeing El Reno and Ponderosa I would have to say that they would have walked through our tournament pretty easily. El Reno and Ponderosa are very elite teams and they are great to watch. It is really kind of scary when you look at some the great teams in Kansas and then you see teams like El Reno, Ponderosa, and Oak Park.