I would REALLY like to see an Ask The Ref Fourm for the kids division.
I think a lot of the new coaches and parents would really benefit from this.

I also had a first today...
A kid had a another kids arm pulled way behind his back.
He then reached up, grabbed the other kids headgear and jerked the kid back onto his back and won by 2!

I flipped! I yelled "HEADGEAR"! I called the ref over and said (in my offical protesting voice) "Tell me you didn't see that! That was so obivious! Tell me you didn't see that!"
He said in a verycalm and respectful voice...
"Sir, No I did not! I was out of position! I was on the other side and was making sure the arm was not in danger and did not see it happen! I heard you yell it and I instantly looked to try to see it and I did not! I'm sorry!"

What do you say to that?
I sooo want to just FREAKOUT!
But, all I could do is just say "OK! Thank you for being honest"

He then said sorry again & thanked me for staying clam & understanding.

I'm still in shock! LOL! I didn't know what to do or say.
I have to say it was the wierdest/nicest interaction I have ever had with a ref in the wrong!

Oh well!

Plz add an ask the ref fourm!

Sounds like a good ref to me. I would rather have wrestlers head gear pulled than a dislocated shoulder. One ref cant see everything.

That same ref has been awesome ALL DAY! When I get his name I will post it. I wish the would put ref numbers on the state shirts.

Ifyou are cradling a guy but do not have him turned enough for the 45°, couldn't you argue that you have control???
I say yes!
Sooo many officials have just said "You can't argue this with me. Its a judement call!"
Its an easy way out of admitting you made a bad call!
We need to do something in the future to assist coaches from letting them use this as an excuse!

Your suggestion ... of adding an "ask the ref" to the kids forum ... is a worthy one! But, who would the "correct" answer come from?

Our official on the Kids Board is not very adept at posting on our forums. Plus the "judgement" in wrestling IS a big part of the decisions!

I heard a lengthy "discussion" yesterday, to point this out. Some, say the rules are very "black-and-white" others say they are very gray. I've seen and been part of two knowledgeable wrestling people, sitting side-by-side, and disagree on a call.

It is so very hard to adequately narrate what you have seen, either verbally or in writing. Even the rule book shows snapshots of situations. But these are two-dimensional! They can't show what you can't see.

Even BLT's scenario, where a cradle is locked up, does not say what the other wrestler has locked up. I've seen referee's checking the shoulders of a wrestler who still has control! (defensive pin) perhaps for several seconds or longer. Yet, no points are awarded.

I've bemoaned the lack of finite scores in our sport in my clinics. Most times, a takedown is clearly a takedown to 99% of those watching. But too often other factors sneak in! Was the action at the end of the period, was it in or out-of-bounds, did the opponent have a leg hooked or a whizzer or any variety of actions!

I've often suggested that the sports that have a "goal" are easy! Did the ball go through the hoop? Did the puck cross the line? Did the ball break the plane? But at times you even get arguments in these sports! Plus, they often have video reviews!!

It is always left to the viewpoint of the interpreter who has a 2-dimensional view from his or her angle!

A referee being out-of-position is probably the most frequent "alleged crime" committed by officials! But, what action is the official suppose to watch ... is he/her suppose to watch an arm in a dangerous position or the head gear being pulled on the other side?

As coaches we definitely have a selected view! Our ability to move around the mat to try to see what the official is looking at is rightfully restricted.

I guess it is human nature to want definitive answers that agree with us!! But too often, I suggest, that is not the "right" answer!

I understand! I would like to see a few refs (their names be kept unknown) try to help people with questions and quote the actual rules and maybe even explain them from time to time.
I think it would help educate the people of the sport.

BTW..
The excellent ref's name is Van Kuhn. He is out of western KS.
It has been awsome watching his attitude & professionalism on the mat this weekend!

FYI: There is an "ask the ref" forum. It's called the rule book. Know it and use it so you can prove it.

How many parents actually have a rule book? Most rely on what their coaches tell them. I agree with BLT, it would be very helpful.

Who knows how many parents have ever even looked at a rule book? The first mistake they make is depending on someone else to tell them what a book says.

Isn't that why we learn to read. . . so we can learn and KNOW!

Should I depend on someone else to tell me what the Holy Bible is saying? Or should I read it so I know?

On the flip side, I admit that an "ask the ref" forum would possibly be helpful but actually only turn into critique and opinion. . . just like an officiated match.

June Bug isn't it still a little too cold for you to be out?

No not really DJ. I'm not from Texas or Oklahoma either. I can drive in the snow, and the cold does not bother me.

I hover around bright lights and I eat mosquitos!