How many byes are there in 4a and 321a, and how many kids are only in the varsity spot because their team have no one else to wrestle that weight for them? It seems to me that in MOST instances a 6a or 5a regionals semis and finals are just as difficult as 4a and 321a, there's just one or two extra matches in between for the larger brackets of the smaller schools.

Nigel, the post that you said you could laugh at Specifically mentioned DI wrestlers. Dont bore us with a list of college (all divisions) wrestlers from 123-4A, we want to see a list of DI wrestlers from 123-4A.

Well your gonna get the list anyway

Division 1

Bryce Bahe (Goodland 4A) Minnesota State
Clint Freeman (Ellsworth � 321A) Missouri
Austin Devoe ( Columbus � 4A) Missouri
Matt Murray ( Colby � 4A) Nebraska

Others;

Bryce Abbey (Goodland 4A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Trevor Charbonneau (Clay Center 4A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Jon Haussermann (Norton 3A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Brett Hille. (WaKeeny-Trego 3A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Travis Martin (Ellsworth 3A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Curtis Swager (Goodland 4A) University of Nebraska-Kearny
Dustin Tovar (Abilene 4A) University of Nebraska-Omaha
Christian Alt (Abilene 4A) University of Nebraska-Omaha

Chris Saferite (Augusta 4A) University Central Oklahoma
Side note: Your Precious 5A prodigy Tanner Gardner lost to Mr. Saferite here
November 17 2003 (nothing against you Tanner, cause I like you) Just proving a point

Shawn Silvis (Augusta 4A) (2X Division II Champ) University Central Oklahoma
Aaron Miester (Holton 4A) Labette
Matt Pyle (Sabetha 4A) Luthor College
Pat Casteel (Abilene 4A) Lindenwood

And this list goes on and on, but I got bored and decided to stop there.


Understand that going to a D1 school isn't neccasarily a measure of how good you are. There are plenty of wrestlers listed above that could have gone to D1 schools but they choose not to for 1 reason or another. I will find more when I have the time

Everyone has mistaken me. I listed only 3 6A guys because those 3(johnston, colemen and roberson) r having the most success. They as i said r all 6A guys and happen to be the Kansas wrestlers doing the best in D1 college wrestling. I couldve named off tons of 5A and 6A guys, but those other guys havent had the same success as the three mentioned at this time.

By the way, Bo Maynes was never a D1 all-american. He was ranked as high as 7th in the nation. That guy is a pimp by the way.

Just like graduating from a D-1 school isn't neccasarily a measure of your intelligence.

I find this argument tiresome. Every year it comes around, and every year no one's vote is swayed. But I will say that Manhattan has at least four possible state placers (as well as one who has already placed) on its junior varsity right now. I won't be as dense as to argue that our regionals are easier, but by the Big Dance it all evens out.

How about this: instead of 4a splitting from 5a and 6a for state, why don't we all just tell Nigel that 4a state will be held in Salina from this year on, so we can be left alone?

Prant you totally missed the point I was making with my comment, probably becuase you didn't read the whole comment. As I siad ther eare plenty of wrestlers who could wrestle at a D1 school but they CHOOSE to wrestler somewhere else. They do this for financial reasons, legacy reasons (like their parents might have gone to a school), But the most prominant reason is simply because of the school itself and the degrees offered. I think everyone can agree with me, not very many wrestlers go to college thinking afterward they will do nothing but international wrestling. That said the purpose of going to college is for the education. Take for example Tanner Gardner. He probably coudl have gone to any of the Big 12 schools wrestling programs, along with Minnesota and others. But he choose to go to Stanford. Not only is he getting to wrestle but a top flight education at a prestegious school. Another name that comes to mind is Shawn Silvis. He could have gone to a D1 school but he choose to go to UCO. I don't know what his motives were to do so but as you can see he's fairing just nicely. My point has simply been you can't really say that 1 class is tougher or better than another just based on how many D1 wrestlers they have.

Is Kyle Potter Wrestling JV now. If so is manhattan jv going to chase county this year on Febuary 14th. If so he may get to wrestle colby monnington of herington a 2A school that should be a good match

thier is some unbelievable talent at the d2 d3 and even juco level. ITs this simple most of them couldnt survive a d1 school simply because of the grades ive seen wrestlers from these small colleges tear the hell out of d1 talent.

Justin Dyer - Olathe South(Oklahoma) Not to bad
Josh Carroll - Olathe North(Appalachian State) - Not to bad
Eric Akin - Bishop Meige(Iowa State) - Not to Bad
Rick Burris - Emporia - SMSU _ Not to Bad
Tim & Colin McKee - Meige SMSU - Not to Bad
Nolan Cisper - STA Norwich (Military School) - Not to bad

At some of the larger programs in the state some kids can't even make the team just because of depth in the room. If Kansas were a state of 5 million or more people then there would be more 6A schools. I personally think there should only be 3 levels 6A, 5A, 4A, Then everybody would have
a 16 man or a subregional to go through. Maybe they should only take the top 2 kids and have wild cards. Who knows - this is the system we have - so work with it. If you have something to prove, you can wrestle kids wrestling - only 1 class. Or wrestle freestyle in the summer and try to become a 1 class state champ. You all have plenty of opportunities to prove you are the best at your weight. So let your actions speak and go wrestle the best. Goodluck 1A2A3A4A5A6A Wrestlers.

This topic was on 6a and Losing records at the Kansas State Tournament. Not a topic of which class who has the most DI atletes. Most everyone agrees that the majority of our DI athletes are from our bigger schools in Kansas. BUT, it was not the topic at hand. The topic was that on the average the big schools brackets aren't as deep as the smaller schools. It's rare to see a good wrestler in 5 or 6a not make it to state but in 4a it's very common because you have to put together 4-6 solid matches just to make to the show....

I can't really see the point in talking about 6A and losing records anymore. Its been mentioned, its been confirmed by several people from the 6A realm, what else is there to talk about? Excuses will be make, stories will be told, and in the end its going to continue to be this way for a long while.

If you want to make things more exclusive, go back to an 8 man state with Regionals, subs, then state. If was done that way for years and it really took something to be a state qualifier. They only placed 4 at state as well.

If that is too radical then you have what you have.

Twister

i dont want to jump back into this subject again. But id say that the overwhelming majority of D1 wrestlers are the best wrestlers in the country. And the fact that the dudes i mentioned earlier have excelled in the toughest division states that they are most likely the best in any division in college.

Its obvious that those D1 guys r the best (for the most part) because about 90% of all the best US freestyle and greco wrestlers have came out of D1 schools. Id say there is a higher percentage of D1 olympians, olympic medalists and champs than any other division in college.

Also they did have a way to prove if D2 and 3 guys were better than D1 guys. Years ago the NCAA had the D1 national championship that was open to D2 and 3 champs. Yes, its true that some D2-3 guys did well, but the vast majority did not win the title or place. And these D2-3 guys were representatives of their division and were the best of the best of their division. For the most part the D1 guys mauled them at the championships.

Dear Nigel:

When did Minnesota State-Mankato go Division I?

I believe they are NCAA Division II!


The Wrestling Mall Division II Rankings

NCAA Div. II
1/13/2004
# Team
1 North Dakota State
2 Central Oklahoma
3 Pittsburgh-Johnstown
4 Nebraska-Omaha
5 Western State
6 Ashland
7 Adams State
8 Findlay
9 North Carolina-Pembroke
10 Augustana (SD)
11 Nebraska-Kearney
12 Mercyhurst College
13 Minnesota State-Moorhead
14 Central Missouri State
15 Fort Hays
16 Gannon
17 Wisconsin-Parkside
18 Minnesota State-Mankato
19 Chadron State
20 San Francisco State

A wrestlers record at the end of the season is not always a good example of how good they are now, for as unable to wrestle my sophmore year so last year my record was not the greatest cuz I started out really weak. Now that I have gotten back into it and am 23-3.

Who am I, What's your point. Of course wrestlers change from year to year but if you have a 3-17 record going into State your probaly not going to win a match, well in 6a you might.

Spikegreely-
OUR STATE TOURNAMENT IS JUST AS TOUGH AS ANY OTHER CLASS. Saying what u said is ignorant and u obviously dont know too much about wrestling if make comments like that.

blake trullinger smnw- westpoint

4A has screamed this crap for years. Truth is if you cant place in 4A State you are probably not going to place at State in ANY other class.

Yes, in 4A it might mean wrestling more matches against better kids to get there, but you either have it or you dont when it comes to top 6 any class.

My guess is most of the whiners here are guys who didnt have it in 4A and are looking for excuses.

There is merit to almost every argument I have seen on this topic except that one class is better than the other.

Just noticing the discussion and wanted to put something into it, a few of you say that 4a is tougher than 6a when i have known quite a few 6a wrestlers who have placed at 6a state one year(not winning it), just too see on the other mats at the coliseum, kids winning the 5a and 4a state title that they had previously beaten earlier in the year.