Ha! That is very funny. Thanks for the laugh! I can't stand sermons either. I know the Bible mostly from reading it on my own ala Abe Lincoln.

Not comparing myself to that great leader - I'm just stating that he loved the book but 'hated' church. I feel a lot the same.

Nothing personal intended towards anyone.

Take care.

I'm lost! I don't know why this thread was started and I can't tell which side of the issue most of the participants come down on. To beat or not to beat? That is the question!

Maybe you have put the question too black and white?

Personally, I come down on the side that it is always wrong to hit a child (there, that's pretty black and white for ya!). That we have better and more effective tools than that. We tell them hitting is wrong - yet we hit them. Sends a double-message in my opinion. The Bible folks like to bring up the 'rod' passages. I don't deny the Bible or the rod passages. I think the rod just means discipline/punishment which is not synonymous with spank. Additionally, the same said book also talks about the rod being used on the back of fools. Now I ask, which of us ADULTS have not done something foolish in the last week? Well, did we get a literal rod beat down over us? If not, why not? If yes - by whom and with what intensity, frequency and duration?

However, I think I'm in the minority position on this thread (which is fine with me). Most on this thread think it is fine to spank their kids. I believe one even used the comment of giving his kid a fat lip . . .

When I bring up with what intensity and duration and frequency do you spank them - their reply seems to be silence. Maybe their silence is saying it is none of my d--- business (which again, is fine with me.)

I think you know where I stand. Others can speak for themselves if they'd like.

Dean
tamwelsh@yahoo.com

Physical and Verbal Abuse
physical and verbal abuse
EMOTIONAL AND VERBAL ABUSE
by Beth J. Lueders

Emotional abuse tears at a person's self-esteem and can greatly impair psychological development and social interaction. In children, emotional abuse can hinder attention, intelligence, memory and the ability to feel and express emotions appropriately. For both children and adults, emotional abuse can manifest itself in social withdrawal, severe anxiety, fearfulness, depression, physical complaints, avoidance of eye contact, self-blame and substance abuse. Emotionally abused seniors may feel extreme guilt, inadequacy, depression or powerlessness. Unfortunately, many psychologically abused elderly people are labeled "senile" or "inept."
Verbal abuse takes on many forms including criticizing, insulting, degrading, harsh scolding, name-calling, nagging, threatening, ridiculing, belittling, trivializing, screaming, ranting, racial slurring and using crude or foul language. Disparaging comments disguised as jokes and withholding communication are also examples of verbal abuse.
The well-worn chant, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me" is just not true. As Dr. Grace Kettering writes in her book Verbal Abuse, "Cruel names and labels can hurt us — dreadfully! Many times the emotional damage is unintentional. Crippling comments may seem so trivial to the speaker as to be soon forgotten. But at a crucial moment or from an important person, certain words spoken to a vulnerable, receptive individual can make or break a life."

physical and verbal abuse
RECOGNIZING ABUSE; BOTH SEEN AND UNSEEN
by Holly Hudson

Though prevalent in our culture, verbal abuse often goes unrecognized because it leaves invisible scars. The abusers often come across as nice, even charming, people when they interact with the general public. But behind closed doors, they use cutting words to exert control over those closest to them. And they do it by sending a two-sided message: "I love you…but I don't." The twisted expression of their "love" creates confusion and a sense of helplessness in their victims.
The National Domestic Violence Hotline, http://www.ndvh.org/

Good stuff Smokey. Thank you. But I guess we are bleeding heart liberals who dont REALLY discipline our kids when they need . . . NOT.

Sheesh I hope Smokey never catches me making the kids act up doing sit-ups, push-ups, and sprawl drills. I might get hailed away!

Strawman.

No where do I see Smokey's stuff talking about exercise or drills used for wrestling . . .

Sheesh . . .

I don't believe you have to hit or spank to be an effective parent. Ultimately you need to share your expectations with your child as well as the consequences.

This may sound rough but when our kids were about 3 y.o. they were to make their bed prior to breakfast. (how hard is pulling a comforter up with your sheets and fixing your pillow?) or not have breakfast....after a few little impasses at 3 y.o. no more problems in life making their bed....of course don't know what they did in college in regards to their bed. The 8 y.o. seems to have no problem with the rule either. (.02 cents).

I truly believe that you do need to stick with your word and not fall back on it. If you say something to them .... mean what you say and say what you mean. Follow through without excuses, no matter how tired you are. You are the sunshine in their eyes.

If they gave it all they could in a match they did the best they could -- you as a parent simply aren't on the mat -- all too many times -- parents are wrestling their children's opponents.
The child knows the feeling of losing and if they truly want to turn the corner so to speak they won't let the feeling return.

The tantrums that I've seen even in 6-15 y.o. children on the mat arguing with the ref, throwing their headgear, biting, laying on the mat and crying have been poor sportsmanship at its best. One example happened to be a child of a well-known ref...arguing with the ref!

There have been some great points to consider in this topic. Good parenting is priceless....One parent once told me that children step on your toes when they're young and you're heart when they're older. They grow up way too quick. Take advantage of every moment and make it great!

[quote=in it to win it]after a few little impasses at 3 y.o. no more problems in life....


WOW!!!!! No more problems in life, just for making their bed???
I wish i had this advice 16 years ago.
I'm going to talk to my wife and see if we can make another child just so i can try this.

Give me a break, thats the most ridiculous thing i'v ever read.
What works for one kid will not work for all kids.

Crazy thread! I don't care if your physically punishing your child or verbally punishing your child, if you are doing it when you are still angry, or the emotions are running high you are walking a thin line. Almost all of the punishment I have dealt to my children that I regret happened when I did not give enough time for everyone to cool down. I find with my kids & most kids I know, the lesson is learned better when there is no tears or yelling. Besides, it's punishment in itself if you tell your child to go sit somewhere while you decide his fate!

I only got one thing to say Mr Cavanaugh. That monkey has been abused & playing that geetar constantly is how he is dealing with it. Get your monkey fixed before you try to tell us how to disipline our wrestlers!

Now that is funny! And, I do love the poor OCD monkey!

;-)

Luellen & dwelsh, neither one of you should talk about something you know nothing about. The monkey was not abused & does not have OCD, FYI he has an overactive thyroid combined with a metabolism that runs out of this world, not to mention I had to take him off chew due to the tobacco nazi's. Plus with the economy the way it is, I am working 13 different jobs & he only gets to exercise when I make posts. So, for any of you that are tired of seeing my posts, keep in mind that I am doing it for the monkey.

I feel the love. Do it for the monkey. Post away! Monkeys rock.

Is he any relation to Curious George?

Only by marriage. Monkey's fathers daughter from a different marriage married Georges 3rd cousin twice removed. So, my answer is no unless there is money involved.

Good thought "in it to win it", you are absolutely correct. Consistency is the key, if you tell your children what is wrong and what the punishment will be then don't follow through with that punishment, eventually your children will realize that talk is cheap and push the envelope further. However, if as a parent you follow up with the stated punishment or known punishment each and every time, then your children will get the idea and realize that there are consequences for their actions.

Also, I do believe in spanking, and I do spank my children when it is required. But my wife and I also believe that the punishment should fit the crime.

This post began with what sounded like a parent losing control, and has progressed into a political debate about spanking vs abuse. I strongly feel that it the parent's responsibility to raise proper children and that if the parent can't determine when that and loses control then that parent needs to realize this and seek guidance before it escalates into something that could become dangerous for the parent and the child.

Pat your in denial coupled with a severe case of enableing. That monkey has obviously been abused. I also see many signs & symptoms of a substance abuse problem -dilated eyes-twitching ears-facial tick-cant stop moveing. IMO you need a profesional intervention now before its bye bye monkey. You can get it all done for free thanks to our new presedent.

Denial? You need to quit trying to crucify Monkey! He's got issues with his thyroid I'll give you that but your making monkey out to be a full blown Meth Head! Luellen, have you ever heard of dedication? honing your craft? I know this is a wrestling website, but man, it takes work to become a world class geetarist. As Booker T once said, "don't hate the player, hate the game".

LOL

Hey who's been shaving your monkey?