Winfield 4A - pretty sure

Anyone have the count for Schlagle or Topeka Highland Park?

Any more updates before it's officially released on Thursday?

There is strong speculation that Topeka Highland Park's number dropped and that they may be the 65th or the #1 4A school. This would most likely put SJA in 5A. I guess we will see on Thursday...

The announcement is expected about 10AM tomorrow.

I saw this on another site.
Big 7 2012-13 Count: Official and Final.

1. SFT 362

2. Perry 328

3. Holton 320

4. Jeff West 305

5. Royal Valley 290

6. Hiawatha 245

7. Sabetha 238

8. ACCHS 229

9. Nemaha Valley 201

10. Riverside 196

looks like Hiawatha will be 3A...

Bill,

Per Willy M
"Coach Hogan and BB is the only consistent winning LHS team--and they do play good BB"


According to your idea that Leavenworth should get out of the Sunflower League since they are now 5A, should SM South also get out of the Sunflower league since they are also 5A?

In response you comment that Leavenworth is not competitive in the league in any other sports than basketball. Leavenworth hasn't dominated the league in wrestling but they probably have been the most consistent team in the League in the 30 years they've been in it. Definitely not middle of the pack. You can fact check me on this, but the wrestling team has won as many championships as Coach Larry Hogan's basketball teams.

Also Jay's team's have been knocking on the door for the championship the last 3 years.

I'm looking forward to the battle of Eisenhower road. We need to get the Leavenworth vs Lansing Dual going.

OK!

Leavenworth had a great run a few years ago as repeat-repeat-repeat-?????? state champs in girls track. Then the coach retired.

A couple of bright spots in individuals boys track over the years---do not recall a Leavenworth team title--state or conference.

Leavenworth has not had a winning boys soccer team since 1997 when they made it to the state quarter finals and were beat by Wasburn Rural.

A couple of competitive volley ball teams a few years ago--same coach as the womens track--and then she retired.

Girls BB state champs 20 years ago--good coach left--not a lot since.

Baseball--mid pack 6A at best over the years.

Softball ???????.

Golf, tennis, mumbly peg? ?????????

Wrestling. Do not recall either a Leavenworth conference or a state team championship---do remember some very good Leavenworth individuals/champs/college and international wrestlers, and now an MMA fighter.

Shawnee Mission South. Another school, another town, another situation. Probably a better overall sports history. Don't know but think South's 81 student enrollment drop was caused by some SM District internal boundary and feeder school changes. South will remain just as competitive in Sunflower sports as a 5A school. Doubt if the conference will boot them (or take in KC Wyandotte).

Why is/was Leavenworth not competitive year-after-year in more sports? 1) the military connected student population and their family transfers VS established student population in other towns and schools. Difficult to build a winning tradition in several sports when the coaches get the individual athletes for only a couple of years---always in a rebuild situation. 2) Student athletes in Johnson County (Shawnee Mission, Blue Valley, Olathe) specialize and play a lot more highly competitive off season club sports.

Expect better things at a 5A Leavenworth. Would like to see a new 5A conference with Leavenworth, Lansing, Turner, Mill Valley, maybe St. James Academy, perhaps Big 4A Bonner Springs, plus ??????.

NE KS 5A wrestling just got very tough(er). Should be a lot less regional byes, less state qualifers with only one or zero regional tournament win(s). Don't remember Topeka HP as being particuarily tough in wrestling. Now, if KSHSAA will subjectively balance the regional assignments (spread the weaker teams through out the regional tournaments), it could get very tough!

Never intended to denigrate Coach Jay or his wrestlers with my original posts. But at 5A, Leavenworth is where it should have been years ago. LHS will probably increase it number of state qualifers---probably not much change in the number of state placers.

Nuff said!!!!!

Bill or Willy M,

I find it strange that you know so much about Leavenworth High School sports and and you're the wrestling guru of Leavenworth county but you can't remember one of the five Sunflower league championships Leavenworth won in wrestling (the same number as basketball).

PS Leavenworth is one of the three schools in the Eastern part of the state to win a state championship in the big class albeit 40 years ago. Also one a boys state track championship.

Fan of the Sport.

Sent you a PM

Hi all -- former Imac wrestling coach and LV Times sports editor Jeff Holmes calling in from Iowa. And it is so nice to see Lansing arrogance is alive and well as usual.

First of all, Coach Jay, way to stick to your guns. Always nice to see the blue and white being well-represented on the mat with a good coach; Schmidt taught you well.

Bill, I'm not even sure where to start with you. I'm not sure if there have been major changes in the last few years, but I know when I was there, Imac, Pleasant Ridge and (yes) Lansing had as much trouble with transient students due to the Fort. Possibly more so; the officers all seemed to want to live in Lansing for some reason. Your post makes it sound as if the majority of the Leavenworth student body are military dependents; I challenge you to prove it is a higher percentage there than it is in other the other three "metro" schools.

Yes, LV is out in the relative "boonies" compared to the rest of Sunflower, but they have also been a good fit there for decades. Have the Pioneers had the worst overall success level of all League schools over the last decade, or are there some JoCo schools with the same -- or worse -- numbers? I challenge you to find that out, too.

As for the enrollment differences, well, you'll love this one. I was in Kansas from 1997 through 2004, the first five years of that at Imac. Over that time, the Green and White was the smallest school in the KVL and were LESS than half the size of the next biggest school in the League (Perry). YET, over those five years, the football team won either three or four League titles (and beat Lansing four years in a row), won probably four out five boys' basketball championships, and were competitive (as in top two or three) in volleyball and girls' basketball every year. Heck, we even managed to move into the top half of KVL wrestling tournament my last year and won three League duals (with 14 kids).

And, the football team went at least two rounds deep in the playoffs three times, the boys' basketball team went to State and the volleyball and girls' basketball team went to State four years in a row each. Both soccer programs went deep into the post season most years as well. And that was as a SMALL 3A.

Yes, Imac's enrollment finally has forced them to go to the DVL, but the run they had a decade ago only proves my point.

My point is that enrollment shouldn't have anything to do with this. I applaud LV for staying in the Sunflower and hope they turn things around. But if they decide to leave, I'll be willing to bet they'll make a good decision as to where to go. Bill, I challenge you to come up with a better reason than the ones you've given.

Best to all -- Go Green, Go Blue!!!

JLH

Hello in Iowa. This is coming to you by dog sled.. Things must be slow in the drab, dull frozen north---the corn and beans should be in and snow is covering the fields--and you have the time to get involved in a local discussion.

Lots of your points I can rebut.

1). Did not demean Coach Johnson or his wrestlers. To me he lost his cool and raised an issue---but that seems to be how a lot of this community reacts.

2). Lansing has never suffer the transient student population nearly as much as Leavenworth. Why. We do not have as many active duty military families, nor do any of our high school students live on the military post. The Lansing population is more of a military retiree, Dept of the Army Civialian community. I have no figures to cite, but I hhave lived in Lansing for the last 19 years and I think I know the community. This is after Living in Leavenworth City for 10 years--my son played football at Leavenworth in 83, 84, and 85 (they were bad then and they haven't got better since. Could not block, pass, tackle, all synched, and do what a football TEAM needs to do. Why could they not do it---because the kids were together for maybe 2, at most 3, very rarely for 3, even less rarely for 4 years of practice and games). I did not make this up, this has been the Leavenworth mantra, alibi, excuse for the 29/30 years I have been here). As for Immac and PR, good programs--doubt they have a transient student problem as large as Leavenworth--know both have some success.

3). The Kaw Valley League is not the same league as it was when you were here. It is now a conference with 5A and big 4A schools. Immac would not now be competitive with a full schedule in this league. Immac is now a ?A school, in the DVL, and thats where they should be, playing schools their size--and they are not dominating.

4). It is not just enrollment that affects Leavenworth sports, it is the 1). the transient student population and 2) they are playing Johnson County kids who all play off season highly competitive club sports. Football fields at Heritage Park in south Johnson County are full playing off season 7 on 7 (doubt there are few if any Leavenworth kids playing. Same goes for soccer--15 years ago there were three competitive Leavenworth/Lansing/Immac competitive soccer teams playing in Johnson VCounty. Think the LVN Soccer Association now has one boys and one girls HS level competitive club team. See in the paper that some middle school age and younger teams have some success in softball. Do not know of any local club VB teams but think a few girls play on KC teams. Know there is a succesful KIDS Wrestling Club local--not sure how many high schoolers wrestle in the off season. kingStudent athletes today are specialist---if a kid does not play competitive off season sports---he is behind the power curve.

5). Leavenworth is a 5A school this year--except for football (because of the 2 year lockin). A recently completed Leavenworth School District population study projects district enrollment will drop in the near future, and remain low for the next 20 years. Conversely, Lansing continues to grow and has a bond issue on the November ballot to build a new 1200 student high school, expandable to 1600 students Basehor continues to grow and could be a 5A in a few years. Mill Valley is now a big 5A.

Give the Leavenworth student athletes, their parents and supporters, and the coaches a break--let them feel the joy of success (winning)-or at least not loosing by some ridiculous high scores. The only consistent winner at leavenworth HS is Coach Hogan and his BB program--and he is consistent in the Sunflower.

One poster said Leavenworth won the state wrestling tournament in 1972. Absolutely great!!! Not sure Leavenworth was in the Sunflower then--may have been in the Centennial League with Topeka school. Don't think half of the Sunflower schools had been built by 1972. SM East, S, N, and NW were probably there. SM West may have been built after 1972. Lawrence Free State did not arrive till the 1990s. Think Olathe N may have been the only Olathe HS in 72---East, South, and NW have been built since I got here. Stillwell Blue Valley, and maybe Blue Valley North, were the only BV HSs. Lots of changes.

Closing, IMO the best thing for Leavenworth HS is to drop out of the Sunflower and join in a new 5A conference with 5A Lansing, Turner, Mill Valley, perhaps 5A St James Academy, and either some big 4A schools, Bonner Springs and Basehor, or the three 5A KC, Kansas high schools (Washington, Schlagle, and Harmon). But, I bet, Leavenworth will never agree to being in a league with those slugo inner city KC, Ks schools.

Pardon any speling and gramer erors. I type faster than I think---or do I think faster than I type

"...slugo inner city KC Ks schools."

I have nothing to add.

Bill

Just want to provide you some updated info based on your comments above.....

1. Leavenworth, Lansing and Pleasant Ridge have a pretty good number of high school kids wrestle during the spring and summer. Not all of them compete all the time but we usually have 20-30 kids in the room for practices.

2. You mentioned not having high school level team sports in our area such as soccer, volleyball, etc. We have some but most of the kids are forced to play on teams in the Kansas City area because of KSHSAA rules. For team sports you can only have a set number of kids from one school on your club team. The number for every sport is different but it makes it hard in our area to have enough club teams to stay in compliance with these rules, therefore kids have to go to the KC area to play on those teams.

3. I think you would be surprised at the actual number of kids playing on a variety of club teams in all sports in the Leavenworth/Lansing area. Volleyball has a great program for kids that was started by Julie Schlater, baseball has the Reds and the BlueJays (each started/supported by the respective high school coaches), basketball and track have the Force, soccer has LUSC, etc. All of these are great club programs that get our kids experience before and during high school.

4. One of the reasons you see the football fields in Johnson County is because that is a club sport down there. Their middle schools do not have football or a lot of other sports for that age group (to include wrestling).

This is not meant to get in the middle of this debate....just wanted to provide you some facts based on the way things are currently.

Bottomline: The main reason you don't see a lot of local club level team sports in our area is because of the KSHSAA rules that limit the number of kids from one high school that you can have on a team. (If you have questions on the KSHSAA rules please contact Will Cokeley as he is a great supporter of that organization and their rules...ha!)

Shawn Budke
Head Coach
Leavenworth County Spartans

PS- You talked with my son a couple of weeks ago at the Lansing soccer game.

Thanks for your reply.

I did talk to your son at a Lansing soccer game. Could tell he was a wrestler from 15 yards away. Had that wrestler look and body: buff, maybe a little caulifllower, plus he was wearing a wrestling club T shirt. Think he said he is an 8th grader at Lansing MS and will wrestle for Coach Averil as soon as MS football is over. Really a nice young man, carries on a very good conversation--and READY TO RUMBLE. Will have to go see Lansing MS wrestle.

Did not intend to denigrate Leavenworth HS, its athletes or coaches. As I have said, my older son attended and played football at Leavenworth--my wife was a teacher and guidance counselor at Leavenworth.

I also know about the KSHSAA rule on quote quote HS squad members on off season teams. In the early and mid 90s I sponsored, managed and coached competitive youth soccer teams that played in a youth league out of Topeka, then at Heritage Park in Johnson County. We played in the Kansas State Games and traveled to tournaments in Topeka, Emporia, KC, and St. Joe. A successful team--sent 9 club players to play college soccer: five to William Jewel at liberty, and four to community colleges. My players were mostly from Lansing with a couple from Leavenworth and a couple from Immac. All local soccer players in those days all started in rec soccer at Ft Leavenworth, and those that stayed local advanced to the Fort based TRAVELERS competitive teams. There was no soccer and no fields in either Leavenworth or Lansing. As me and a couple of guys in Lansing formed rec soccer teams in both Leavenworth and Lansing, the Fort TRAVELERS folded. I picked up most of the better players and formed my U14 and U16 Johnson County team. There was one or two competitive local teams with older players (U16s then U18s). Note: these teams were not affiliated with an umbrella club, they were all independent, formed by the individual coaches.

After the 1995 ??? KSHSAA "SQUAD" rule it was difficult if impossible to form local competitive teams. For some reasson kids from the three local high schools, especially Immac kids with Lansing kids, did not want to play together. Without players from all three HS, and all at the same HS squad level (no mixing of varsity and JV players from one HS) , it was futile to try to play competitive club soccer. A very great disappoint. That KSHSAA SQUAD ruling affected all high school level competive teams in all sports in all Kansas small cities and towns--minimal effects in the bigger population centers with multiple area high schools and established youth rec and club sports: i.e. Johnsonm County, Topeka, and Wichita.

Hats off to those few locals who have stayed with an/or initiated youth and club teams: Coach Slater, the Leavenworth Soccer Association, the FORCE, your youth wrestling club, and any and all others who spend a lot of time, effort, and as you know: MONEY to keep the programs going.

I do and will continue to believe that much better things would be in the future for Leav HS athletes and teams in 5A and if they dropped out of the Sunflower. A great thing for all local HS sports would be for Leavenworth and Lansing to join in a new 5A conference with some other area 5A schools (Mill Valley, Turner, St. James, maybe Bonner who is on the cusp between 4A and 5A, plus others left un-named. Will 5A Leavenworth do better in 5A wrestling---can't say. 5A is tough and got tougher this year with Leav, SM South, and St. James.

Keep up the good work coach. We all depend on the wreslers you and your coaches prepare for our high schools!!!!