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Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? #254961 02/16/20 11:51 PM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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What in the world has KSHSAA done!! If you have a first round match at girls’ state and win, but then lose in the quarterfinals, you will have to default in the placement round if you get there!! Right?? What a mess.


Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254963 02/17/20 02:00 AM
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Aaron Sweazy Offline
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There needs to be an emergency session held by the KSHSAA and KWCA about this. Maybe an immediate adpotion of what South Dakota does;

https://www.sdhsaa.com/Portals/0/PDFs/Athletics/Wrestling/DeviationsfromNFHSRules.pdf


Yours in wrestling,

The Swayz
swayz.wrestling@gmail.com recruiting help, promoting the sport& more!
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254964 02/17/20 02:24 AM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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It is a coin flip for the medal match if that happens. No one likes it.


Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
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Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: Coach Malay] #254965 02/17/20 02:45 AM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Coach Malay
It is a coin flip for the medal match if that happens. No one likes it.


It’s only a coin flip if they have both met the match limit. Imagine if this decides the team title. This is not good!


Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254966 02/17/20 02:48 AM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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They could do a scramble of 3 pools. Pool winners round robin for 1st through 3rd. Pool runner-ups round robin for 4th through 6th.


Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254973 02/17/20 03:41 PM
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Kit Harris Offline
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From what I understand, there is National Federation criteria list that is being used to determine the winner if it would be the 6th match for BOTH wrestlers. If one wrestler still can wrestle another match, then she is declared the winner.

If both have already wrestled 5 matches, then (in order)....
1) if they have already wrestled in this tournament, then that wrestler is declared the winner
2) a common opponent with win/loss difference
3) if one was penalized for unsportsmanlike
4) fewest penalty points in this tournament
5) most falls
6) most tech falls
7) most points scored throughout the tournament
8) if none of these criteria sort it out, then both are named the same place (I assume that means both are named 3rd or 5th place) and the team points are divided equally between the two wrestlers

Last edited by Kit Harris; 02/17/20 06:37 PM.
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254974 02/17/20 03:43 PM
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Kit Harris Offline
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I like that scramble pool idea, Rick. That would be best. Sports like volleyball do something like that at state. That would have been best for this year's girls state.

Hopefully, the girls tourney can go to two days next year, but figuring out the scheduling will take some work.

Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254977 02/17/20 07:36 PM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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In all honesty what I would love to have is a one site state tournament. 3 days at the Expocentre. Wrestle girls on Thursday/Friday and boys on Friday Saturday. The atmosphere for the finals would be amazing.


Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
mmalay@tregoeagles.com
785-769-3082
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254979 02/17/20 07:46 PM
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RightCall Offline
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A one site state tournament needs to happen!


"Don't complain, Wrestle."
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254980 02/17/20 07:53 PM
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As a parent of wrestlers this is very tough to understand how or why we would have set this up the way we did. I do however understand that this is the first year for Sanctioned HS Girls Wrestling and the kinks will get figured out as we grow. Although we recently went to a great tournament that we fell into this same problem of 12 wrestlers in a 16 man bracket and several wrestlers fought very hard on the back side only to be told they had to forfeit their last match due to limitation of matches in one day. This was explained to girls who were first year wrestlers and have grown these past few months to make it to that placing and not yet understanding all the rules of wrestling. To see the look of hurt, disappointment on their faces was very sad and very frustrating even for myself and it wasn't even my wrestlers. This was only a regular tournament. I can not imagine the feelings they will have in a STATE tournament if this does happen. Could we not have just gone with the same rules as the boys and only take the top four when all this was decided? We knew numbers in the beginning? Also as Girls wrestling grows isn't that what we would have to do if we do end up with four regional tournaments instead of just two? I do hope for the best for everyone and know that this has to be very hard on the ones in charge. Good luck to all as this is still a very exciting time for HS Girls wrestling.

Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254983 02/18/20 02:38 AM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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We don’t have any girl wrestlers, but I care about kids and I care about wrestlers. Is there any way the coaches with girls in the state tourney could propose something like the scramble/pool format to KSHSAA! It’s not to late to do what is right!


Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254984 02/18/20 02:44 AM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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Or maybe this is what’s right and the fix can come next year if a fix is needed. It’s still an exciting and historic event, but it does bother me to think that several girls might end a great season with a match limit default win or loss. Just seems anti-climatic.


Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254986 02/18/20 03:51 AM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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I like the pools. But I dont know how to split them. I dont like the bracket set up for state either. We have 4 losses on the year and 3 are to the same girl. She took first at Regionals we took 3rd and unfortunately we are on the same side since they are 12 man brackets. I was hoping for a split like a regular bracket with the 2 & 3on the same side. I'm not a huge fan of how all of this is going to fall but I understand there will be sacrifices this first year. And that if we want change we have to bring proposals to the state board for next year.


Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
mmalay@tregoeagles.com
785-769-3082
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254989 02/18/20 02:04 PM
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Kit Harris Offline
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A big problem with the pools is you're not guaranteed to have a true championship finals match. And that's not good.

Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: Coach Malay] #254990 02/18/20 02:50 PM
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JCook Offline
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Originally Posted by Coach Malay
It is a coin flip for the medal match if that happens. No one likes it.

Why is it a coin flip?


James Cook
Smoky Valley
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Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254991 02/18/20 03:36 PM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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I misspoke. It is a coin flip if no other criteria is reached.

Last edited by Coach Malay; 02/18/20 03:37 PM.

Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
mmalay@tregoeagles.com
785-769-3082
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: Kit Harris] #254998 02/18/20 06:05 PM
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RJW1 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Kit Harris
A big problem with the pools is you're not guaranteed to have a true championship finals match. And that's not good.

You would if you had 4 pools of 3 (each quarter bracket) and then put the four pool winners in a bracket for 1-4 and the runners-up in a bracket for 5-8.

Last edited by RJW1; 02/18/20 09:39 PM.

Rick Williams
Colby High School
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #254999 02/18/20 06:12 PM
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Kit Harris Offline
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True. That would work well.

Pools could be divided:
1E-4W-6E
2W-3E-5W
1W-4E-6W
2E-3W-5E

This is probably the best idea yet.

If this meet stays one day next year, they could qualify top 8 from each Regional. And add one more per pool.

Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #255003 02/18/20 08:50 PM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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I do like that set up. Is it too late?


Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
mmalay@tregoeagles.com
785-769-3082
Re: Defaults in placing rounds at girl’s state? [Re: RJW1] #255004 02/18/20 08:53 PM
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Coach Malay Online Content
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Is it ever too late to do the right thing? We still have 9 days.


Michael Malay
Trego Community High School Head Wrestling Coach
mmalay@tregoeagles.com
785-769-3082
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