I think some of you missed my point. I love takedowns. I coached for 25 years in this state preaching them. My point is that 75% of all backpoints and falls come as a result of pinning combinations hit directly after the takedown. I think Coach Hemmerling knew that too from the post I read above. I don't have anything against taking someone down and letting them up but I think it has to be with the thought in mind that my kid is looking for that backpoint opportunity at the end of the takedown, not just the "crowd pleasin" aspect of the takedown. Now if they have a takedown state championship or national championship then I will have to rethink. Sanderson is looking for that everytime he shoots a takedown and he leads the world in backpoints most of them coming off that combination. I have seen a lot of kids get their butt whipped when they tried to be artistic and get a bunch of takedowns for takedowns sake. But as you say anyway to "peel the onion" and if it wins so be it. I do think Falls are worth a lot more than crap though cause they count more last time I looked, and I am saying that in the spirit of fun here.