Regional Assignments

Are the regional assignments being released today?

I think so. They have not been posted on KSHSAA site yet. Basketball has been released.

Please don't use that word on this forum.

Just called KSHSAA. They have not received confirmation from all the schools yet. The goal was to release the assignments today, so they will be posted as soon as possible. When that is, who knows...

What word? KSHSAA?

The James Naismith word!

They will be here when they are released...


http://www.kshsaa.org/WRESTLING/wrsttmp.html

so, hopefully tomorrow sometime then.

Any word yet why they have not been released? Dont schools have to put in to host a regional? It should not be a surprise when Rick calls you and says, "you have a regional." Unless they are still trying to decide where Silver Lake is headed.

Sometimes circumstances change and a school will decline the opportunity; and, with the current financial situation many schools are facing I would not be surprised if some may have taken a pass due to the costs involved.

It is expensive to host such events and the cut of the gate schools receive does not cover all expenses--especially the increase costs of utilities and expenses associated with the wear and tear on buildings--not to mention expense of custodians and workers unless an all volunteer force is organized.

Don't know if this is the situation, but would not be surprised.

Maybe the cut should be adjusted to cover the schools costs and KSHSAA could make some cuts or dip into the war chest they have built up over the years...

Just a suggestion.

For a Kids tournament concessions should nearly cover the cost.

Personally, I think the economic gains that schools will receive from schools staying in hotels, eating at restaurants, and filling up at local gas stations would help to sway an administrator to hosting a regional. However, I could see where administrators would not want to deal with the headache of a regional during these unwary economic times in the public school system.

They have to save money to purchase those sweet State tournament T shirts! lol

and don't forget those awesome medals!

For many regional tournaments if the schools kept 100% of the gate they would not cover the costs associated with even a one day tournament.

A regional tournament, especially of the two day variety, is often an economic boost to our communities but that does not translate into less pressure on the school budget or an increase in the school budget.

Concession profits in most schools are kept by the organization(s) that man them, unlike kids tournaments where those who man them are also kids club members.

Don't want to get into a p***ing match about this; just advanced one theory based on current events as to why hosts may not yet be lined up.

Hey, if we got into a p!$$!ng match I'd win easily because when I wake up in the mornin' I p!$$ excellence.

Well played, sir, well played.

Just curious, what are the percieved or estimated costs of hosting a regional and the expected revenue streams?

I couldnt give you any exact numbers off the top of my head and I assume that a 321 or 4A regional would be much different than a single day 5 or 6A tournament with only 8 teams.
I believe the school gets 25% of the gate after paying the Officials, the Plaques and Medals are provided by KSHSAA. out of that 25% the school pays all expenses.
Things the school must pay have been touched on above. but include things like, Custodial help(possibly overtime), table workers, computer personell(to run brackets and update online), paper and copy expenses, Seeding meeting food and drinks, T-shirts for all workers, Hospitality Room expenses for coaches/workers/cheerleaders/officials, Last year we rented a Dollumar mat to make 3 full mats fit in our gym $300, Score Clocks if necessary for 3rd mat. I am sure I am forgetting some other things but in the end I have been told it usually costs $1000-$1500. ( I also know many of the things above could be donated or volunteer and usually are.)
The community makes that back and then some. Also the team would have expenses to travel to a tournament especially if they stay overnight, pay a bus driver, fuel and food. So in the end it benefits the community but may cost the district a little bit. Right now most districts are really tightened up and may not be as willing to commit to this.
I figure that may be the reason for the delay. KSHSAA really should consider giving a little more to the schools, it is a tremendous amount of work for the A.D. to run a tournament.

James is on target here. Another big expense he did not include is the cost of utilities and this will vary depending on weather, and of course will be greater for the two day tournaments.

Also we CHOOSE to hire the County EMT to have an ambulance and a response team present at all times when we host the regional tournament.

Finally, believe it or not, wrestling tournaments are real hard on buildings and especially the plumbing and bathroom fixtures. Depending on the age of the building repair costs are something that have to be expected. Paper towel & soap dispensers as well as trash cans seem to come in for more than their fair share of abuse--especially after the consolation quarter and semi-final rounds

So, the school shuts down the heat on weekends?

There is occupancy expenses but that is a lame issue-

Most likely the issue is the KSHSSA is trying to figure out the weakest 5A regional so we can have a good complaint time about 5A and 4A

Only kidding Will!

Mill Valley Kids Tournament - 800+ wrestlers
High School Regionals - 112 wrestlers (5A/6A)

"So, the school shuts down the heat on weekends?"
Yes, our thermostats are set back for weekends and evenings. We can override for events, but if there are no events the temp is down. Isn't this the fiscally responsible thing to do?

"There is occupancy expenses but that is a lame issue-"
Seriously? You obviously do not have a clue as to what it costs to maintain/heat a space like a 2200 seat gymnasium with exterior doors opening and closing or what it costs to operate such a facility with lights, water, toilets flushing, etc.

"Mill Valley Kids Tournament - 800+ wrestlers
High School Regionals - 112 wrestlers (5A/6A)"
Unclear as the point you are making Chief. Both events are expenses to the district. The question I would ask is what portion of the expenses for the use of the facility, equipment, etc. are reimbursed to the DeSoto school district? Here in Norton we have charged nothing for our local kids club to use the gym and nothing for the use of our wrestling room, mats, scales, locker rooms, etc. etc. I think this is as it should be. BUT, these things may become more expensive for clubs. School budgets are set in July/August and when costs increase (as our local utility rates did last month) and/or funding decreases (as has happened five times already this year) something has to give.

What James and Greg said is exactly correct. There is no money to be made hosting a regional tournament. I take issue if even the communities of the hosts make money. The communities I have been in the last few years there are no businesses there. That is because the hosts are from such small or rural schools that there is no benefit. Last year and the year before for instance I stayed across the state line for a regional because there were no motels within 15 miles of the host city.


____________________________________________________________

PEGGY: Title IX of the Civil Rights Act clearly prohibits sex discrimination in public schools, and guarantees equal athletic opportunities for all boys and girls.
COACH: Yeah, well, Roe vs. Wade doesn’t apply in my wrestling room.

Since money is so tight for regionals just send 32 to 64 to state and watch the money roll in. I undertand we are in a financial crises, but someone needs to step up and get it done, the season has begun....

KSHSAA has a lame excuse for not posting the regional information, funny that our sport takes a back seat to football. I also noticed that the basketball regional's have already been posted.

i send an email to kshsaa asking for an update. will wait and see if an answer comes.

Oh well

I emailed KSHSAA last week. Terry Bowden sent me a email stating they would be out this week.

Does anyone remember it being this late previously. I never can remember the date they are supposed to be out but this seems very odd. I asked our AD if they might be having trouble finding enough host schools and he said typically when that happens they send out an email begging for volunteers. He said that hasn't happened as of last week.

"Out here" we almost always know which school has been asked to host before the official announcement is made; but thus far there there has been only the sound of crickets; almost makes me think potential hosts have not yet been contacted.

has school administration tried to work with the community for grants for such tournaments? i know that pittsburg hosts the kids sub-district each year and does so without any help from the chamber of commerce etc. however the chamber sponsors softball and baseball tournaments every year. problem is i know all the motels and restaurants are full, the night before the wrestling tournament. yet the baseball teams rarely stay in pittsburg, they usually go across the state line to joplin. i feel the wrestling community as a whole, seems to fail to tap into some of these resources that are there. it wouldn't be hard to prove to the chamber the money that is brought in for such an event. remember the bi-centennial buck, in salina? we all know that the community makes money off of wresting, it's time to take some back.

If you received an email from Terry Bowden it would be a mystery email. There is a Rick Bowden at KSHSAA.

Terry coaches college football somewhere.

University of North Alabama

Rick Bowden it came from kshsaa.

That would explain why he hasn't released the regionals yet...

Maybe we can get Bobby Bowden to take a job with KSHSAA as he is going to be looking for something to do...

Basketball regionals have been released, But Bowling regionals have not been released yet.

So there you go- It is always good to know where you stand in life. At least we are in the same boat as bowling!

Back to occupancy expenses- Since I obviously don't have a clue as to how much it costs to hold an event at a gym. Can someone tell me the difference in cost between a regional basketball tournament over a 4 day period for and a one day wrestling event.

A regional is 2 days for MOST of the schools in Kansas.

my bad - and the regional BB tournament for metro areas like Quinter is Feb 22-27 - so tell me the difference in costs.

The difference is in the gate i.e. attendance. Wrestling's most ardent fans and future wrestlers are all out at their own tournaments while their regional is going on.

was in holton last night for jr high dual. ad says they're hosting, but haven't heard the other 4a sites.

Basketball = three nights at central site; two games per night. 4 hours per night; = 12 hours. One person on the book, one on the clock and one announcer. Three people per night.

Regional Touurnament = day 1 of 6-8 hours and day 2 of 11-12 hours = 17 to 20 hours. Three mats = three clock operators and three scorekeepers. At head table = scorer, asst. scorer and announcer. 9 people for 3/4 of the tournament

Understanding that not all do it the same way, I am going to compare the two events based on the experiences I have as the result of having been directly responsible for hosting both events:

Sub-State Basketball = one custodian on duty; EMT? Probably not.
Someone on duty for blood clean-up? Puh-leez!
Regional Wrestling = Custodians on duty entire time and with overlapping schedules. We hire ambulance/EMT and have on site. Blood spill person(s)? Yes and they should have hepatitis inoculations! (I just cringe when I see some places using kids to do this).

Substate Basketball = no set-up except to roll out the ball rack and turn on the scoreboard. Sweep the bleachers when done.
Regional wrestling = SEVERAL hours of prep work and set-up and then several hours of tear-down and clean up.

Substate Basketball = teams and fans in and out; not very hard on facility
Regional Wrestling = teams and fans "camp out" all day for two days; hard on facility; plumbing, water use, etc.

Substate Basketball: electricity use on Thursday and Friday not too much more than usual as most teams would be practicing or playing games anyway. The big difference between Basketball & Wrestling in utility use is the Saturday component of the Regional Tournament.

Sub-State Baskeetball = scorebook, pencil & buzzer.
Regional Wrestling - bout sheets, computer, printer, mat tappers, bout card runners, floor "security"(gotta keep fans off the mats!)

Sub-State Basketball = games are almost completely confined to the gym and gym lobby.
Regional Wrestling = A large portion of the facilty is used; room for seed meeting and coaches meeting(s), room for cheerleader hospitality, warm-up area, cafeteria in addition to the concession area (some will eat two to three meals on site!).

The Biggest difference between sub-state Basketball and Regional Wresting is the manpower needed and the extent to which the facility is used.

Hosting a regional wrestling tournament is a LOT of work and very labor intensive (as in lots of hands are needed) and the week of it is about all an A.D. works on. That said, it is a GREAT event and we would/will never turn down the opportunity to host it.

So what's the hold up on the announcement?

This was under the wrestling announcements on the KSHSAA website. I am guessing that Rick wrote this up on Dec. 7.

2009-2010 NEWSLETTERS

December 7, 2009
REGIONAL WRESTLING ASSIGNMENTS – With the conclusion of the football season I’ve finally been able to focus upon wrestling matters. The long football playoff system of 153 football games played over a four week period requiring the selection and assignment of officials at least a week before the first playoff game makes for an extremely long November. It seems that everything else has to take a back seat to football for that entire month.
I’ve contacted potential regional host sites but am encountering challenges – ranging from financial challenges for some schools who can no longer host events due to the added cost of such events to scheduling conflicts has meant that I need to re-examine all of the regional assignments. While I’ve been able to finalize host sites in a number of classes, there are still a number of classes that I’ve not yet been able to identify a host site. Until I’ve been able to identify the four (4) regional host sites for a class, I am unable to provide the regional assignments.
Given the very difficult financial situations schools are meeting this year I’ve given high priority to trying to identify host sites that are more geographically centered within a configuration of schools that would be attending the regional. Until the four host sites in a class are identified and agree to serve as a host site, I cannot finalize the assignment of schools. While I don’t have a specific deadline for identifying the regional host sites I am giving this the highest priority at this time.
Once the regional sites are identified and the schools assigned, we will post them on the KSHSAA wrestling home page.

Check the KSHSAA Wrestling page “2009-2010 Announcements” page next week for more updates and announcements.

This letter clearly supports how ridiculous it was to add another week of football games when they expanded the playoffs to include 50% of the teams. I know there is NO WAY that was a cost effective decision. Now wrestling has to suffer a delay and schools are whining about paying for hosting a regional... I am not in favor of cutting any extracurricular programs but I do think it is not very wise to burden existing programs from a cost perspective by expanding them or adding even more programs that fiscally drain our schools even more (ie. bowling.)

The "extra" week of the football season has had nothing to do with the budget cuts making it too expensive for some potential hosts.

No but it

Another week of football games is an additional cost. Football does NOT pay for itself.

The additional week CLEARLY contributed to the delay as Mr. Bowden (that is Rick not Terry or Bobby) pointed out that he has been too busy with football.

Mr bowden says " ...seems that everything else has to take a back seat to football for that entire month" Apparently not for bb regionals. Their season ends three weeks after wrestling state. But they have information posted.

This should have been done way last summer! It isnt like it sneaked up on our leaders at KSHSAA! Oh what are we going to do! We need to find sites to host regional wrestling tournaments. This has never happened before!


oh my

Occupancy expenses: Mr Mann, you state that The main difference in cost is manpower? How many of the BB buzzer beepers and score keepers are paid to work a bb game?
How many table workers, ref wappers, and meal providers are paid at a wrestling tournament? It takes a lot of work from a lot of people to run a tournament. Most of those are not paid a dime.

I can only speak for our school district, but all of them. Meanwhile the wrestling workers are all volunteers. I believe the clock operator or the official scorekeeper for ******ball receives somewhere around $100.00 per game if I'm not mistaken.


_________________________________________________

HANK: I thought you were busy teaching girls to blow up basketballs. What did this turn into a desire to ruin wrestling?
PEGGY: Oh give me a break. I don't see having a girl on the team would ruin it. Did a woman judge ruin the Supreme Court?
HANK: Yes, and that woman's name was Earl Warren.

back in the day--depends on the school as to who is paid and who is not. Some who work ours are paid and some are not. The point I was trying to make (and apparently unsuccessfully) was the huge difference between a sub-state bb tournament and a two day regional wrestling tournament.

back in the day. . .basketball assignments are not done by Mr. Bowden; they are handled by the person who does volleyball in the fall. As you may know vb is over several weeks before the end of football playoffs. Apples and Oranges.

Will--again, what do the football playoffs have to do with schools saying no to hosting regional wrestling tournaments due to expense as the result of BUDGET CUTS ANNOUNCED AFTER the playoffs were concluded? Not all schools are involved in the football playoffs; in fact only 1/4 are after the first play off game, 1/8 after the next game, etc. Only four per class are involved after the buffer week. A VERY STRONG PROBABILITY that many schools who said "no" were NOT involved in the football playoffs, or if they were, for not very long.

sportsfan02: our school employees who work the games as admission and table workers ARE paid due to the master contract; non-school employees are offered the same wage; some take it and some do not. Our people do not get rich doing this; it is barely above minimum wage--$7.50 per hour.

Yes I'm sure ours is simular but the people I was speaking of are not teachers. The teachers often work as announcers, security or gates and I'm sure they have the same deal as you describe.



____________________________________________

KAHN: If my girl doesn't wrestle, I'll show you who put sue in Souphanousinphone!
COACH: This all goes back to Title IX, Dick Nixon's biggest mistake.

All BS aside, can someone who has been a part of hosting a 4A wrestling regional, post a complete list of workers required to run a regional. We are sticking our nose into it, trying to guesstimate what it would take, and would like some help coming up with some idea of how many we need to recruit. I would love for our school to host a regional, so our kids can sleep in their own beds those 2 nights!! Our boys miss their mommies if away from home more than a few hours.

Geez guys...why the animosity? It's still two months away. I'm pretty sure they'll get most teams into a regional.

When we hosted at Eudora, twice in a three year period, We were fortunate to have all volunteers for the table workers. These were alumni & parents mostly and each received a free t-shirt for their efforts. We would let Blue Chip set up a stand for the tournament and let them sell whatever they wanted, but the trade-off was that they provided us with free t-shirts, labeled "staff" for all of our workers. They also had unlimited access to the hospitality room or course. Very few of our faculty members worked the tables, and only did so because they wanted to volunteer. I realize that this would not be possible in all schools.

At my current school, we only have room for two mats, but we are going to start putting in for regionals every year and hopefully we will get one one of these days.

I am sorry for being so grumpy.

Come on Gary, you know you would like to know. It's usually done by now.

With the over 600k it was reported in the KSHSAA bank account they might have to start helping the schools host these tournaments. If budgets will not allows schools to do on their own.

Just a thought, because from what I am hearing not many schools are raising their hands to host.

Greg,
Not speaking about the financial impact but from the available time to invest. Rick would have had another week to work wrestling regionals if the football playoffs wouldn't have been expanded. 50% of the teams ARE involved in the first round of playoffs. It costs more money to have another round of playoffs, don't lie. Schools are willing to spend more on the big two Football and Hoops but not on other sports. They will even move funds around to make it look like football isn't costing as much as it does. Football costs more than ANY other sport and leads the pack in serious injuries as well.

I like football but when we start talking about cuts and funding it is time to expose it for what it fiscally is.

JUNCTION CITY WOULD LOVE YOU HOST 2010 REGIONALS!!!!! Contact their Head Coach!!! And everyone loves the way we run tournaments!!!

My guess is the 5A and 6A are not the problem. It is likely easier to find schools willing to host those since they only last one day. The problem is more likely in the smaller schools where two days are required.

True.

You could always expand the 5 match limit for regionals.

That would also mean the Chiefs won the super bowl and hell froze over because everyone knows if a kid wrestles more than 5 matches in one day hell will freeze.

I doubt that Wichita schools will have the ability to host 6a, They cant even give their teachers and staff raises let alone put money into wrestling.

Dear Santa,

All we want for Christmas is:

1. Health
2. Happiness
3. My 2 Front teeth, and
4. OUR REGIONAL ASSIGNMENTS!!!!!

Contrary to what is being said on here, KSHSAA has all of the 4A regionals done. That is what we were told today.

"Josh



THANKS for offering the use of your facilities and staff/wrestling community. We have the four 4A sites identified and am working toward finalizing the other three class sites.



Rick
"

Hmm, any hints as to which 6A school(s)in Sedgwick County will be hosting?????

A little birdie told me NW is hosting a regional as is Manhattan. No confirmation yet, but pretty good source.

mc

Drop the 5 match rule and make the 4A regionals one day events! That would save money.

I mentioned that yesterday! Great minds think a like!

maybe an exception for regionals would be a cost savings - one day- AND a little hole in that silly rule.

It's been said a lot but still amazes me that our kids can wrestle live in practice for an hour or more a day, 6 days a week and are not allowed to wrestle 36 minutes spread out over 8 hours in a tournament.

YOu guys continue to waste your breath trying to find a reason for another of KSHSAA's stupid rules. Most of the time there is no rhyme nor reason...........

Cue up sportsfan's entertaining response................

Not to beat a dead horse...

They have been posted for 1-2-3A and 4A.

are these on the kshsaa site cause I looked and did not see them posted

They are posted where? Must of been a mess up as they are not posted now.

They're listed under the wrestling announcements page.

Class 4A REGIONAL ASSIGNMENTS – Friday and Saturday, February 19-20, 2010
Chanute High School – Eric Methvin, Regional Manager - Altamont-Labette County, Augusta, Chanute, Coffeyville-Field Kindley, Columbus, El Dorado, Fort Scott, Garnett-Anderson County, Independence, Iola, LaCygne-Prairie View, Mulvane, Parsons, Rose Hill, Towanda-Circle

De Soto High School – Dave Morford & Steve Deghand, Regional Managers - Baldwin, Basehor-Basehor-Linwood, Carbondale-Santa Fe Trail, De Soto, Eudora, Kansas City-Bishop Ward, Kansas City-Piper, Kansas City-Sumner Academy, Lenexa-Saint James Academy, Louisburg, Osawatomie, Ottawa, Paola, Spring Hill, Tonganoxie

Holton High School – Mitch Beims, Regional Manager - Abilene, Atchison, Chapman, Clay Center-Clay Center Comm., Concordia, Easton-Pleasant Ridge, Hiawatha, Holton, Hoyt-Royal Valley, Lindsborg-Smoky Valley, Meriden-Jefferson West, Perry--Perry-Lecompton, Silver Lake, Topeka-Hayden, Wamego

Pratt High School – Curtis Nightingale, Regional Manager - Andale, Buhler, Cheney, Clearwater, Colby, Hesston, Hugoton, Maize-South, Nickerson, Pratt, Russell, Scott City-Scott Community, Ulysses, Valley Center, Wellington

Class 3-2-1A REGIONAL ASSIGNMENTS – Friday and Saturday, February 19-20, 2010
Hoisington High School – Lonnie Irvin & Dan Schmidt, Regional Managers - Anthony—Anthony-Harper-Chaparral, Brookville-El-Saline, Cimarron, Elkhart, Ellsworth, Garden Plain, Gypsum-SE of Saline, Hoisington, Holcomb, Lakin, Larned, Leoti-Wichita County, Lincoln, Little River, Lyons, Meade, Montezuma-South Gray, Moundridge, Salina-St. Johns Military, Stafford, Sterling, Sublette

Marion High School – Tod Gordon & Chad Adkins, Regional Managers - Burden-Central, Burlington, Caney-Caney Valley, Cherryvale, Cottonwood Falls-Chase County, Douglass, Erie, Eureka, Fredonia, Halstead, Herington, Hillsboro, Howard-West Elk, Leon-Bluestem, Marion, Neodesha, Peabody-Burns, Rosalia-Flint Hills, Sedgwick, St. Paul, Whitewater-Remington, Wichita-The Independent

Norton-Norton Community High School – Jeff Wallingford & Greg Mann, Regional Managers - Atwood-Rawlins County, Belleville-Republic Co., Beloit, Bird City-Cheylin, Ellis, Goodland, Hays-Thomas More Prep-Marian, Hill City, Hoxie, Mankato-Rock Hills, Norton-Norton Comm., Oakley, Oberlin-Decatur Comm., Osborne, Phillipsburg, Plainville, Scandia-Pike Valley, Smith Center, St. Francis, Stockton, Wakeeney-Trego Community


Rossville High School – David Wonnell & Curt Brecheisen, Regional Manager - Atchison-Maur Hill Mount, Bennington, Burlingame, Council Grove, Effingham-Atchison County Comm., Eskridge-Mission Valley, Highland-Doniphan West, Horton, Leavenworth-Immaculata, Marysville, Minneapolis, Mound City-Jayhawk-Linn, Onaga, Oskaloosa, Richmond-Central Heights, Rossville, Sabetha, St. George-Rock Creek, St. Marys, Troy, Wabaunsee, Wellsville

Ah, ok thanks for posting them.

Look under the Announcement page for the partial list

Once again KSHSAA has proven they don't know a damn thing about wrestling!!

Pratt regional 40.5% ranked wrestlers 50% ranked teams
Holton regional 25.0% ranked wrestlers 20% ranked teams
Chanute regional 20.2% ranked wrestlers 20% ranked teams
DeSoto regional 14.3% ranked wrestlers 10% ranked teams


Is this all the better KSHSAA can do? What a joke!!

It is not that "I need to know! or that I will die if I cant find out where the regional will be located"

I am certainly not perfect when it comes to thinking ahead and making plans. Just ask my spouse!

The issue that leaves a bad taste in my mouth is "Invitations were extended to potential regional wrestling host sites early in December".

Football playoffs, unforeseen construction, financial crisis, and schedule conflicts all have been listed as excuses. How about - I messed up and didn't take care of this when I should have.

The west 4a regional has always been tough and will continue to always be tough. Just the way it is.

Why not try to split up Andale and Valley center?? Send Mulvane to Pratt and one of those other teams to Chanute!

Probably has to do with mileage.

3-2-1A Norton Regional:
51% of ranked wrestlers
70% of ranked teams

you guys are good at math!

I think it is pretty clear that regional assignments are made based as much as can be on geography now, without a thought to competition levels. Cost is the #1 driving factor now, as maybe it should be in the big picture. I am all for having parity in a perfect world too, but if schools are going to cut programs if they cost too much this looks like it is the way it's going to be for a while.

Now if a couple years from now school funding is up and the economy is banging again. I think you have a reasonable argument.

I am a wrestling fanatic too, but this is the real world.

who is the hold out? 5a or 6a school?

As they always have been.

I support the Regionals being seperated fairly, BUT;If we were to try and create parity by selecting regional participants by rankings other than location, then we would need to learn to be more patient as well. The season is 2 weeks old and we've been throwing a fit to know where the regionals are 2 months from now.
You could select the hosts, but you couldnt assign the teams until basically the end of the season. There is no way to forsee injuries, illnesses, suspensions, expulsions, etc.... There is no guarantee the percentage of ranked teams and the ranked individuals listed above are going to be that diverse at the time the Regionals actually take place. Those percentages will fluctuate each time the rankings are updated.

Man, I didn't mean to get everyone so riled up. I realize regionals are geographically oriented...it's just interesting to see how they break down. Personally I always liked going to the difficult regional because placing there set you up well for the state tournament, which is the true measure of a successful season. Good luck to everyone (except Moeder, that guy thinks he knows everything!!)

Thats right Johnny Boy, everything EXCEPT: "rendezvous" Remember that one??

5A and 6A wow, I must be blind because they are still not done????

Desoto,...wow, Will has some pull after all..lol

I want to highlight a point about a regional from last year-to preclude it happening again this year.

The 5A Regional at KC Bishop Miege sent regional wrestlers to State who did not win a regional match, and several wrestlers who won only one match. Why? Lots and lots of openings in about every weight bracket.

Not fair to lots of wreslers in every weight class in every regional in every classification. Should have to work, and work hard to get to STATE.

Should be a provision that all state qualifiers have to have won at least one regional match. If no qualifier, than have a procedure to identify and select a non qualifing wrestler in the same weight class in another regional to fill the vacancy. Would also use such a procedure to fill out State bracket vacancies due to injuries and DQs at region.

Added. May also look at breaking up regionals that geographically have a lot of schools with small teams (i.e. lots of opens) by cross assigning/sending some of those schools to another near by regional. I will not mention schools or districts, but I think everyone knows who I am talking about.

I also know of a kid who ended the season with a 38-6 record. 5 of the 6 losses were to kids who placed in the top 4 at state and the other to a state qualifier. This wrestler went 3-2 at regionals and did not qualify for state.

i don't think that you will find a PERFECT solution, someone, somewhere will always feel slighted. i agree i looks bad when a wrestler makes it to state with a sub-par record. the problem is if you move regionals, or "break" them up there might still be a wrestler who wudda cudda shudda made it, but didn't. i think the system the way it stands is the best that it can be, you will always find a problem, be it with a certain team, regional, weight class, or individual, the main thing is the top 6 at state are still the top 6- that day. it is a cop out to believe anything else, if you wudda cudda shudda, doesn't put medals around necks or plaques on the wall, HARD WORK, AND PERFORMANCE DOES, THAT'S WHY WRESTLING IS WHAT IT IS.

If we are all satisfied with SuckerPunch's response then we should hear no more about the inequities and unfairness in getting to State as 1/2/3/4A wrestlers (one out of 4) and 5A and 6A wrestlers (1 out of 2).

For the next two years I am more concerned about saving programs that might be lost than making regionals equatable. Our sport along with others might be staring down the barrel of some very challenging times.

After wrestling 4A out West and coaching wrestling 4A out East, all I can say is "it is what it is"

We are getting closer! only two more responses to go! yea

here's a better stat for you, only the top 6 place,used to be top 4. it doesn't matter where you are from (east/west- big school/small school). sure the small schools have a 16 team regional, they also play one more game in football playoffs, but i don't see them lining up to call out hutch because they didn't play that extra game. if it sounds like i am comparing apples to oranges, you guessed it that's my point, that's what comparing east/west/big/small is. i never hear this argument after kids state when, east/west/big/small is all mixed. when the match is over, the smoke has cleared, the hand is raised, i'll bet it's just like tossing a quarter 100 times 50/50.

We could go back to 16 man regional, eight man state for 5A and 6A, seed the top four.

Not sure I understand a couple of the posts sinc my post about the 2008 BM 5A regional sending wrestlers to State who did not win a matc at region. My local HS had at least one, if not two, wrestlers go to state without a win. Still do not think that was fair to a lot of good wrestlers in all weight classes everywhere who wrestled down to the wire but got eliminated deep in the backside. Not everyone gets to State, but those who do should have earned it.

As for not having a repeat of the BM regional this season, split the 3-5 inner city KC schools with small wrestling squads to the other KC/east Kansas 5A regional, or perhaps assign one school to the Topeka/Central KS regional.

I am not knocking any of the KC inner city schools and athletes---my wife is a counselor at one of these schools. These athletes, coaches, and parents all work hard and support their programs in all sports. As I recall last year, it was not kids from these city schools who back-doored into State, it was kids from suburban schools with big squads who filled their team's opens with JV wrestlers--who then got wiped out in the first round at State.

i know that it doesn't seem fair, but you can't have an invitational state championship. you don't win matches unless you wrestle them. i know that some guys will go out and lose when they should have won, and others will win when they should have lost. i know that doesn't seem fair. i know that it doesn't seem fair to throw a jv kid in there and some kid on the other side of the state is a better wrestler than he is. bottom line is if you can't make it out of your regional you won't place at state. you are making a statement for the "other rans" i'm making sure that no one is taking anything away from a state placer just because they don't think life/regionals are fair. i'm not sure that you can come up with anything else, i know you make it sound easy, in your post. BUT WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WHEN WRESTLER #1 FROM THE INNER CITY SCHOOLS GOES TO THE TOPEKA REGIONAL AND GETS BEAT OUT, AND WRESTLER #2 GOES TO THE KC REGIONAL MAKES IT IN, BUT IT'S NOT "FAIR" BECAUSE WRESTLER #1 IS 5-0 AGAINST WRESTLER #2? its the old argument to "prepare the child for the path, not the path for the child"

This would be so much more fun if the 5A and 6a were released!

We would have hard data to complain about. As it is now it is just last years frustrations.

i know they are "only" rankings, but chiefs rankings as they stand today (12-22), small schools have 72 and big schools have 69. two days ago it was big schools 73/small 70 (there are some ties). about as close to my 50/50 prediction as you can get.

unbelievably there are some things that "just don't seem fair!" for instance @119 8 wrestlers are from big schools, 5 from 5a, 3 from same regional(if they stay the same from last year). here we got some kid ranked in the top 3 all class that may be lucky to get 3rd at his regional.

i don't understand the complaints because i believe (in all aspects of my life) that things will all come out in the wash.
now- if you don't use stain fighters (hard work/ dedication) your clothes WILL be more stained the the fellow who did. now who can we blame? i know the washing machine company.

Made it back from Western Kansas and the Snirt- Snow and dirt!

I wonder if our glorious leaders have made it back to work and will release another update on why they have not found a place to hold 6a and 5a regionals?

If 5A & 6A don't have Regional Assignments, why not let everyone qualify and duke it out at the new Intrust Arena? Seriously, put a 32 man bracket per weight and go from there. Seed by regions (North, South, East & West)and record. Determine a "true" champion. What do you think?

I would be all for the 5 & 6A schools finding the snags in the downtown parking system prior to my attending an event at the new arena.

Lets do it!

lets do something!

Why not let another school that isn't that classification host it? I mean if the class itself doesn't want to host it, why make them?

Class 5A – Saturday, February 20, 2010

Kansas City-Turner High School – Garold Baker & Peter Sierant, Regional Managers
Kansas City-FL Schlagle, Kansas City-Harmon, Kansas City-Turner, Kansas City-Washington, Kansas City-Wyandotte, Lansing, Overland Park-St. Thomas Aquinas, Shawnee Mission-Bishop Miege

Newton High School – Brian Engelken, Regional Manager
Andover, Great Bend, Hays, Hutchinson, McPherson, Newton, Salina-Central, Salina-South

Tecumseh-Shawnee Heights High School – Warren Watson & Rob Dennison, Regional Managers
Bonner Springs, Emporia, Gardner--Gardner-Edgerton, Shawnee-Mill Valley, Tecumseh-Shawnee Heights, Topeka-Highland Park, Topeka-Seaman, Topeka-West

Wichita-Bishop Carroll High School – Slade La Munyon, Regional Manager
Andover-Central, Arkansas City, Liberal, Pittsburg, Wichita-Bishop Carroll, Wichita-Kapaun Mt. Carmel, Wichita-West, Winfield

6a?

Three sites have been secured; still looking for the fourth. Sites will not be released until all four have been identified as regional assignments may have to be redone based on which school is the fourth host.

This would be much easier if you went with two regionals and an eight man state bracket. 25% of the wrestlers at state just like 4A...

I was wondering with the close proximity of most of the 6A schools why two regional tournaments could not be hosted at one site. Even here in little Norton we could host two 8 team tournaments using four mats in our main gym, or spread out and use two mats in each of our two gyms.

Received this from Mr. Bowden on Monday:

Regional managers - updates:

Again on behalf of the schools, coaches, wrestlers and parents, thanks to the 15 of you who have stepped forward to serve as a regional host for one of this year’s regional wrestling tournament sites. Next week (Monday) we will be sending out a “packet” of information to you to assist you as you prepare for the regionals.

We have posted on the wrestling page of the KSHSAA web site weekly announcements for the last few weeks. On those announcements, I’ve also listed the regional assignments now for class 5A, 4A and 3-2-1A. Hopefully within the next couple of days we can find that last Class 6A host location. . .

most of the 6a schools i have been to, have smaller gyms.

According to KSHSAA, BVNW has agreed to host a regional but KSHSAA does not like to ask a HS to host two major events. They are hosting a BB Sub state. If BVNW wants to do it, why wouldn't KSHSAA let them?

Chief, how many times do I need to tell you. Asking for rational thinking from KSHSAA is like asking for Cokeley to not speak his mind. Ain't gonna happen................

Some need to look a little harder, Just saying!Rossville is hosting both for us! GREAT JOB ROSSVILLE!

The same school hosting both regional wrestling and sub-state bb has been done over the years. It has not been too many years ago that Beloit hosted both wrestling and basketball. In the fall of 2007 Norton hosted the Regional Cross Country Meet AND Sub-State Volleyball Tournament on the SAME day (regional cross country does not last very long, but requires a huge amount of prep time).

For many reasons it is best if these events are spread around, but if BVNW is, in fact, the only option there is no "policy" against them having both regional wrestling and sub-state bb and; if in fact they are the only option, will probably do so.

Just to let everyone know. We were given the basketball substate way back at the end of November. Then with wrestling, from my conversations. We were asked with a hesitance (due to us having substate), would we like to host regional wrestling. They had 2-3 other schools in mind but with the budget problems their admin's so NO. Reason worried about not being able to break EVEN. We are not worried about this as most every position except for 2 maybe 3 are all volunteers. We have been talking about being able to host regionals this year, way back to last Febraury. We got a second gym, so no more wrestling room or 3 mats in 1 gym and more seating in the original gym.- YEAH. In fact this weekend it will be inaguarated with its first tourney.

And I was told that Rossville hosted both in 2004 or 2005 by Holly Graves

I know we have hosted regionals 2x between 2000-2009. Basketball ? They did host regionals for bball within the last 10 years just dont know what year.

Confirms what has been said--hosting both has been done before; and, no doubt, will be done again if a school hosting both is the only option.

She is correct, it was 04/05 school year. My first year volunteering to do the the cooking for the hospitality room at the school.