undefeated wrestlers?

Who's left with a perfect record?

Zack Grimes Osawatomie 29-0

Mike Costa, Hiawatha

Danny Floyd of Osborne

Parker Madl - BV
Cade Blair - VC
Tyler Anderson - CC
BJ Finney - AN
Bryce Hood - LOU
Mark Kolmer - EMP
Lucas Vincent - ON (Hasn't wrestled yet)

Jered Rice - Phillipsburg 285

Joey Dozier - Garden City 145#
I think

Tyler McMichael Central
Zach Hoehn Wellsville

Ethan Jirak - Oakley 215

Dakota Hayes and Clay Mulligan-Scott City

Colten Picking - Abilene

Taylor wuthnow 215 abilene

Andover Central:

Zac Gentzler 103
Jake Gentzler 125
Alex Bontz 135

Taylor Moeder - Saint James Academy 27-0 130lbs

Taylor's record is all the more meaningful when you consider some of the competition he has sought out. Hat's off to the St. James boys for putting who they wrestle above what their record is!

dalton miller- campus

I agree. Taylor Moeder has to be the KS wrestler of the year so far!

Has anyone beaten Jace Banner?

I believe he is undefeated. He has not been on the mat since winning Salina South on 1/9. I think its a minor issue and is fine.

I'll second that! Tremendous gas tank, never out of position or making silly mistakes, and lightening fast on his feet. Aggressive and fun to watch!

Ethan Mumaw 20-0 at 171

moeder lost this past weekend at shawnee mission north
which is funny because they dropped out of the garden city tournament to go to a much easier tournament

nick pearch from blue valley is still undefeated

John Siale #215 Chaparral 14-0

What happened to moeder? It says he was dq'd

"edited portion" and he gave him a good ole pounding down collar tie across the back of hte neck, and the ref booted him. I wasn't there, so maybe someone else can clarify it.

Taylor is not a dirty wrestler, so I think we may have had an overzealous referee here.

Taylor was called for a Flagrant Miscondut call after a stale mate for an agressive swipe on a collar tie anticipating the whistle. Did he need to do this, absolutely not. I know he is not very proud of it. Did it qualify for an ejection? I do not believe it was even close to calling for that, but obviously I am very partial. The ref felt in his decision that it warranted it and it was called. I received several calls and emails suggesting we file a complaint with the state. As far as I am concerned he was frustrated with some minor issues that he should not have let bother him and needs to learn a lesson from this. I have no intentions of belittling the call or drawing attention to the official involved. The decision was made, its over and he now has a loss on his record and he can accept the responsibility fully on his own shoulders. How he handles himself in the future is up to him.

How is Moeder losing a match funny? St. James Academy has had an extremely tough schedule. They aren't ducking anyone for an easier go. Sounds like he didn't get beaten, it was a DQ. Moeder is an outstanding wrestler, period.

Wichita Heights

Daniel Deshazer 125lbs 11-0

Matthew Reed 171 lbs 22-0

And I am 99% sure St. James pulling out of Garden City was not a popular decision by the wrestlers and more than likely an administrative decision due to amout of school they have been missing seeking out the tough matches!

Taylor is an awesome kid who I have enjoyed the past couple years and am looking forward to the future watching at a much higher level! Good luck Taylor and Ryne and the rest of the SJA wrestlers....

Church

That is one heck of a post Tim. Move on and learn from it. That's the kind of kid that we know Tayor to be!

I will give you the benefit of the doubt that "funny" was not the word you were looking for. Taylor was winning 10-3 at the time the match became the official's and not the wrestler's to decide.


Tim is handling this very well. I don't think the official should be cut ANY slack. I violated Mr. Salyer's and Beeson's rule and contacted him myself. Unknown to him I had a copy of the video and I asked for his review of the match. His recollection was vastly different than the video. FM is a call reserved for EXTREME situations and this was not one. When called out and given a chance to review and admit that he had made a huge mistake the official wouldn't admit to making a bad call. So i feel a public tar and feathering is in order. If he doesn't like it maybe he will quit officiating. If you want the link to the match please email me.

I agree with Chief, great post Mr. Moeder.

RULE 5 SECTION 12 FLAGRANT MISCONDUCT (pgs. 21 & 22)
ART. 1 . . . Flagrant misconduct on the part of Coaches or other Team
Personnel are acts which:
a. the referee considers serious enough to remove the offender from the premises;
b. can occur prior to, during or after a match, including the use of tobacco products.
Flagrant misconduct shall be penalized in accordance with the Penalty Chart.
ART. 2 . . . Contestants:
a. Flagrant misconduct is any physical or nonphysical act which occurs before, during or after a match considered by the referee to be serious enough to disqualify a contestant from the match and any additional wrestling in a multiple school event.
b. Acts include, but are not limited to:
1. striking;
2. butting;
3. elbowing;
4. kicking an opponent;
5. use of any tobacco products.

Nice copy job...

I know the rule but for the every day fan it is for situations that are BEYOND unsportsmanlike conduct or unnecesary roughness. EXTREME is my way of conveying the the definition. If what was called in the is match is really FM then there would be several every tournament.

For the record there were no tobacco products being used! The official said that there was a clinched fist blow to the face but that is 100% false.

[/quote]
I know the rule but for the every day fan it is for situations that are BEYOND unsportsmanlike conduct or unnecesary roughness.[/quote]

For the everyday FAN? what about for the everyday official? Shouldn't he have ranking over a FAN?

I mean I know that officials are the perfect human beings but one may malfunction everyonce and awhile as the concept of judgement throws a wrench into the robotic perfect machine that is an everyday official.

As I was not there to witness any of this, but I know that it wasn't called for no reason. The action was obviously pushing the limits annd was not given for no reason. So let it go Cokely and have fun being an "everyday fan" and let the officials do there best

A closed fist punch would warrant an FM call. This was not a closed fist punch, per my sources.

Without having seen the hard collar tie, I would say the manuever that Taylor excuted is akin to throwing a hard elbow down on a power half, and deserved a 1 point illegal move penalty.

Cokeley, is there a problem with postin the video for us to see? Actually, it sounds like Tim and Taylor want to just put this behind them and move on.
Doug

Now I have seen the video. Definitely not a Flagrant Misconduct deserving move. Barely brought the left hand above the other wrestler's head, open palm, "smacking" collar tie. I saw at least 10 of them this weekend at Garden that were as bad or worse. NONE of which even warranted, in the GC officials' eyes, a 1 pt illegal move penalty.

If Mr. Moeder or Mr. Bjorgo want me to take this down, just PM me. I think you will agree the ref went way too far by DQing Taylor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AktzCp7Qtpo

Really bad call. It can't be fixed but let this be a lesson for our refs to learn from.

unfortunate set of events. couldn't see anything on the video to
agree or disagree with the call. didn't look at all too rough, bad timing, but i also couldn't see a whether it was a fist or an open hand. perfect way to handle it moeders, good example for all.

Thats how I feel after the video, kind of an iffy situation to me from the video but not enough to agree or disagree with the call

But seems like the people who were involved are handling it the right way, good job!

I have been watching my sons wrestle since they were in 2nd grade and I have never felt more compelled to write on this forum than I do now. My son wrestled Moeder this week-end and the video that I have shows a clear hit with the fist to his head before the whistle was even blown. I would be more than happy to share my video and I would in turn like to see any video that shows my son being dirty. Right before he was hit, my son was called a vulgar name and the ref told Moeder to watch his language. I understand that emotions can run high, but what happened was entirely uncalled for. We knew from the beginning it was going to be a tuff match for Lukas to win. One of the reasons we believe this sport is so great is because it teaches these young men how to win and lose graciously. This match was going to be no exception. I have a hard time understanding why a wrestler, who is clearly winning, would need to act in such a questionable manner. That was certainly no way that we intended to win a match. There are obviously some biased people, but I wonder how you would have felt had it been your own son?

I have no dog in this fight.From what I saw with the video that has been posted it looked like a bad call.It looked like Moeder was anticipated the whistle for the restart and it didn't come.

From what I saw if anything it should have been a point deduction not a DQ. I have seen a lot worse with crossfaces and when legs are in and someone is working for a turn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3AkmS2ytwI that is my own run in with flagrant misconduct, being however, on the receiving end...just for comparision sake. I dont see anything from Taylor that warrants FM, but i wasn't there.

I don't know much about the rules of wrestling, so I don't know if the call was accurate or not. What I can tell you is when I was leaving the school after the tournament - the BV team was in the hall with the BV coach (the one who talked with the ref during the match) along with another gentleman - they both were talking about how "great" it was that St. Jame's did not go home with a trophy. The other gentleman also told the coach "good job" on getting it done. I told both gentleman how inappropriate and disgraceful their behavior was. I am not the only person who heard them discussing this. In my opinion, its a cheap way to win.

Tate Omli is undefeated and beat a tough kid a The Beliot tournament

I had heard that the ref told the SJA coach that moeder said a bad word after the stalemate call. So I specifically looked for the ref talking to Moeder after the stalemate. I do not see ANYTHING to suggest that the ref is giving Moeder ANY sort of warning or talking to, about such an instance. I personally believe the ref made that up to make his call look more justified. I know Mr. Moeder is done with this, and won't respond, but I would like to know exactly what the opposing wrestler was doing underneath prior to the stalemate, that caused Moeder to lose his composure. I have watched Taylor for years and years, and have NEVER seen him act like what we refer to as a "punk". Something pushed his button, and he made a mistake by overreactin. But the overreaction did NOT justify an ejection. I also want to add that my son has wrestled one of the Bjorgo boys, and had no problems with sportsmanship, and I have never seen them act like punks either. But something happened between these two otherwise fine young men, and it got blown way out of proportion by a referee. I would like to see your angle of video also. I would say to post it and let people judge for themselves. Hate to beat a dead horse, but like someone said earlier, the refs need to learn something from this.

As for the person that heard the talking in the hallway after the tourney, if that happened, you need to take ALL of the people that heard it, and talk to the administration of the coaches involved.

It is getting hard to figure out why anyone would coach or officiate this sport.

These are both good kids from good families - let the thread go back to who is undefeated - no one is going to win from this being discussed any further - too much emotion.

Everything that has happened this year has been because of the official(s)... I guess in this no fault society it's never their own fault, so we find a scapegoat.

I understand it is a high intensity sport and we are all so passionate but it goes back to the old saying, "Make it clear who the winner is, don't put yourself in a situation to let the ref decide for you"

**Disclosure** My comments are not about the Moeder match, but general overall feelings from comments made throughout this wrestling season.

Alex

You are right, the thread got HIGHJACKED!!!

For once, I agree with you.

I have a large amount of respect for most officials. The ones that let the wrestlers decide the match.

I have a large amount of disdane for officials that try to make themselves a part of the show, or have personal vendettas that they reveal on the mat. Or those that can't admit when they do make a mistake.

Officials are like any profession. YOu have the 90% of them that do their jobs admirably, and 10% that give them all a bad name.

Plain and simple, the ref decided that match. Moeder roughed the guy up a little bit, and the ref overreacted. Moeder has admitted he made a mistake. Has the ref?

~ Good men are bound by conscience and liberated by accountability. -Wes Fessler

Although Taylor Moeder may not have handled the ref's decision in an exemplary manner, I'd like to suggest that Taylor's dad, did!

Bad Decision. Maybe. I was not there.

Was Taylor or his dad, justified in Taylor's reaction: Perhaps. I was not there.

But, from Taylor's dad's posts....I like what I have read: He (presumably, Taylor's dad) did not necessarily agree with the ref's decision...but he (Taylor's dad) was, at least, equally critically of his son's "reaction" to a perceived, "bad call"

I'd submit...who among us... has not been there...???

While I have never had the privilege of parenting an "elite" wrestler...I admire Taylor's dad in his reaction to a perceived "raw deal" for his son.... (not that I'm saying that it was a "raw deal", mind you)

But I was left with the impression that although young Moeder, may have gotten a "bad break"...his (Taylor Moeder's) reaction to this decision, was not the reaction that his parents (at least his dad) intended to inculcate into their son.

I'm not only looking for young Taylor to ascend the podium in the state finals, but I'm pulling for him...

Mr. Moeder: although I've read your various posts in the last few years....I have become a fan of your son... good luck

What is wrong with a Parent being excited that their Team, beating another Good Team? I am sure congratulations to the coach were deserved. Nothing wrong or disgaceful about it.

Agreed exactly (anticipating the whistle).

The crossface at around 54 second mark was a hard one.
But, we don't want to pu--ify our sport.

Moder is aggressive, non-stop action. That is why he is one of my favorite wrestlers to watch.

Great post and attitude to the Moders.

Bring that video on! It was a cupped hand. It was a false start and at most unnessary roughness or unsportsmanlike conduct. It is a combat sport and it is rough. Your coach tabled the official and plead for a FM. That is cs in my book!

You know it is a rough sport and I am sure your kid has been called worse by his brother. I know what was said and there was NO warning or discussion by the official, per his account of the event. If you believe the penalty fit the situation you are part of the further pussification of America and the tragic emasculation of young men.

If you have never wrestled you will not be able to comprehend the emotion and energy that surges through your body during a match. If Ryne was losing a match 10-3 I wouldn't want him to win no matter what (unless he came back and out scored his opponent) but especially in this situation. No gift wins.

Beeson, BV finished tied for third because of the points they received from this win and because SJA was stripped of Moeder's points which would have put them in 2nd place. I do think it is disgraceful to gloat over a win or trophy that was NOT earned.

Amen Brother Will! Bring it on. Good post.

Email me and let me know what 'cs' means would ya? As in, 'that is cs in my book'.

Thanks.

Oh, never mind. I just figured it out.

Does it have to do with a certain kind of bird that lays eggs and what comes out of it rear end? Yeah, I bet it does.

Aren't you glad I'm teaching the youth of America!?

;-)

Trust me Beeson. You of all people would want to "stroke" this coach with a right. . . or a left. . or the hand that you love best. . if you knew how cheezy he was.

I won't comment on the call, I wasn't there and don't have a stake. I do firmly believe that wrestling is a tough sport and is supposed to be physical. Ref's in the KC area call uneccesary roughness more than those out west. Big wrestling states such as Illinois, Pennsylvania, Ohio and NJ would laugh at some of the pansy calls made around here.

Matt Jones

Well apparently June Bug was at the Salina TOC this weekend.

You hit the nail on the head Matt.

ROTFL!!! Maybe that has some connection with why we do not have a D1 team in KS . . .

I was wondering the same thing but i loved the way you put that. it most definitely cleared it up for me. haha haha

[Qoute] Bring that video on! It was a cupped hand. It was a false start and at most unnessary roughness or unsportsmanlike conduct. It is a combat sport and it is rough. Your coach tabled the official and plead for a FM. That is cs in my book! [Qoute]

If my son wrestled for coach that had to lobby for FM for my son to get a win that way.My kid wouldn't wrestle for that coach PERIOD!

Amen to that brotha!

Out west they bring that crossface from left field!

My thoughts exactly!

I hope some parents see the above post...Make sure your kid takes ownership of it, learn from it and move on. Great post by Mr. Moeder!!!!

I agree. When I read his post, I immediately thought what a class act this young gladiator has for a father. I think this sport could use a few more Mr. Moeders out there.

And less people like Mr.Cokeley

we ALL need to think before we speak/post. EVERY COACH has lobbied from the corner, for a win in ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.

I try not to lobby from the corner for points, calls, warnings, etc. BUT i will NEVER say that i haven't, OR won't.

Thank you for your kind words. I honestly do expect more out of Taylor than what he showed and we have addressed the event just as I stated. But, keep in mind; it is easy for me to look at what I perceive to be the correct way to handle this because I have made plenty of mistakes on my own to reflect on. Believe me, if he puts me through what I put my parents through, I'll kill him! I am no saint I can assure you. He has made me proud of him all his life, and I consider this to be a pothole in his road of life. I sure hope he chooses to drive around around it instead of thru it next time.
I hope we can now let the guys that really deserve the attention on this thread have their due. Good luck to staying undefeated, and stay FOCUSED!

Beeson's signature says it all, this is a physical sport if you dont like or cant handle it then QUIT. Moeder was clearly frustrated during the match the ref should have made the other kid wrestle instead of backing up while on feet and balling up on bottom. Cant tell if the hand was a fist or open from the video posted so not sure on the call.

he was wrestling a smart match it was moeder a really good wreslte he was winning 10 to 3 in the third Lukas was just wreslting smart wrestling is a hard sport but u need to learn to control your emotions dumb move on moeder part.

Looking at the video the kid made the hard collar tie to the head look a lot worst than it was. If wrestling smart means backing up to the edge of the mat every time you are about to get taken down then this bjorgo is a genius.

The events have absolutely NOTHING to do with St. James as a team or a group and that is wrong to even suggest. There is not a single coach that teaches anything but quality expectations from their wrestlers at this school. Why would you even feel the need to bring the team into an act made by an indivdual? You have every right to express your opinion on the match, but no reason to attack the school. I can accept and expect justified criticism, but I think you're heading in a whole different direction and there is definetly no need for that. The match is over, he was DQ'd, it's been accepted.

This reminds me of the way many used to feel about St Thomas Aquinas. I am sure that SJA has stolen some of their thunder. When a team is doing well and is successful, some people like to criticize. It must be jealousy.

I say, take that jealousy and use it to get better.

There is a lot of wisdom, sound reasoning and logic in this post. Again, my admiration to Mr. Moeder, which I believe his son already recognizes and wants to exemplify in his life.

As for Saint Thomas Aquinas, I know enough about their Kids' program - their coaches, wrestlers, administrative personnel, parents and fans to give them nothing but absolute respect and admiration. Many of these individuals are also involved with their High School, which leads me to believe that they run a top notch and very respectable program there as well.

You are correct regarding STA and I should have done a better job with my earlier post.

I meant to say that regardless of all the hard work, coaching, Kids Club, etc. some people will criticize a team that has continued success. 5-6 years ago, the critics seem to single out STA. Now that St James is on a roll, it seems that they are on the receiving end of this same type of jealousy.

I think what Mr. Moeder is trying to say is Drop It. Both sides, those who agree and disagree with the call. The match is over, I believe that both sides have gotten to tell their side of the story. Now let it go. There are always 3 sides to a story; 1)Mine, 2)Yours, and 3)The Truth. Let the kids get back to wrestling. I am sure a call will be made this weekend that we can all take sides on.

And in college you get investigated and put on probation.

Cameron,

". . .the ref . . . was even considering kicking him out for the (w)hole season."

A referee has no authority to suspend a wrestler for any period of time beyond the tournament he is working.

You guys having some problems with Kapaun Mount Carmel and Bishop Carroll down your way? I am not sure how much success these programs have had in recent years, but I doubt that they bend the rules any more than some of the public schools. Having competed in a league with Thomas More Prep in high school, I can see where such conclusions would arise concerning private schools. I just don't think that accusing them of cheating is appropriate.

I am not sure what you are talking about here but I can assure you that my comment had nothing to do with KMC or BC or any other private school in Kansas. It was merely a sarcastic comment about what happens to successful programs in college as a response to the jealousy comment. In college its not just everyone is jealous, you literally do get investigated and 9 times out of 10 if they investigate, they will find an infraction.

hanging chads again!

Do you think there is a correlation to us CHAD's being a problem.

i guess if we can't agree to disagree, the grievance committee will need to step in and settle this argument.

I apologize for misconstruing your post. I did not see the sarcasm, only a jab at private schools for their perceived improprieties in recruiting. As I stated, competing against TMP in high school, it was an easy way for us to justify getting beat by them when we did (they must cheat). Today, I believe that they were just better than us. Again, I misconstrued your post, and for that, I apologize.

terrible call maybe that ref should start refing some paticake.

Mr. Cokeley and Mr. Moeder are both great guys. And, I'd bet you a dollar that they know, like and respect each other.

"I don't have to be your twin, to be your brother."

really cant tell if it was a closed or open hand, was not there so dont really want to say anything about the match. But I do want to know why Beeson and sportfan02 are not all over Mr.Cokeley for talking with the ref. the last gentleman that said he went up and talked with the ref got ripped for it, seems like these guys pick who they choose to argue with and keep quite when they think they will be made fools of if they argue with others.
Mr.Moeder you are a good sport, I really like watching your son wrestle, good luck to him and I'm sure he has learned from this.

I have given up on trying to educate Mr. Cokeley about the lost art of proper sportsmanship! I do appreciate the way Mr. Moeder has handled the entire matter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhdMJNOVew8
moader ejection

Whoever appointed you to 'educate Mr. Cokeley'? From the way he writes and promotes KS wrestling, he seems to be well-educated already. Did he ask for your help? Let me guess. Hmmm... No....

He admitted that what his son did was wrong. He said he would talk to his son about it. He was EXPLAINING the situation, not EXCUSING it. There is a big difference between the two.

What do you want, a gallon of his blood or his head on a platter? Or what? For him to be your twin?

Diversity is cool. You might want to try it. Just a suggestion. It is not my job to educate you (Thank God).

KansasWrestling1 is not wanting blood or a head I think he is trying to prove his point towards idiots who say his boy was crying about nothing, after seeing this side of the mat, yes he should have been DQ like he was, the ref had every right to do what he done. And like Mr. Moeder says his boy will learn from this.

I was simply referring to him (sportsfan1) wanting to 'educate Mr. Cokeley'.

still doesn't show closed fist or not. can see moeder say something, but don't see referee giving a warning. oh well it's over time to move on.

BS. false start and unnecessary roughness. No fist, just a hard open handed check to the back of the head. He was wrestling, not fighting. Please refrain from "pussifying" the sport.

What this video revealed more than anything is that the camera operator needs to invest in a tripod.

I strongly agree that Beeson's signature does say it all. Moeder should send the video to college recruiters/coaches. His stock will go up!

It's hard to pick up much from these vids (closed hand/open hand...warning/or not). However, one thing that that jumped out at me from the second vid was that the whistle was not even in the officials mouth yet when the the false start occured.

The second thing I noticed about "both" vids is that neither had sound. Sound may have shed more light on what the official was thinking. I probably wouldn't have made the same call, but don't blame or second guess the official for making the call made in this case.

I agree that it is time to move on. I think Moeder keeps his composure and wins any rematch big.

If they wrestle 100 times Moder wins 99 times. This time (the DQ) was the one in a hundred that he loses.

Moder was winning 10-3 with 30 seconds already gone from the final period.

But, yep. I'm ready to let it go. And, I sure would not want to wrestle him in a rematch if I was the other kid. He better be praying he never wrestles Moder again (I know I would be)! Ha.

Classy! Very classy.

PROBABLY THE TRUEST POST ABOUT THIS MATCH.

I saw earlier on the posts that Cade Blair was unbeaten, who has beaten Chase NItcher if anyone?

I'm not pussifying shxt believe me I love to see Moeder wrestle but I dont care how good you are or what you think you mean to this sport if you throw a swing open handed or closed out of maddness and for what reason, you get what you deserve. and I think Mr. Moeder is alright with it so move on big guy let go now. And yes a tripod would have been nice for that camera operator.
Mike Rodriguez
(620)255-1001

The answer is easy as to why I did not "rip" into Will. It was not for fear of looking like a fool, I can do that just fine on my own, as apparently you can also. Will stated before he posted anything that


It would have been rather pointless to get on here and say, "Will, that was wrong." He already knows my stance on the subject. I was kind of hurt he did not call me Mr. Beeson though.

Oh no not me beeson its hard for me but like you said easy for you, I just was waiting to hear from you and sporto but as you stated you guys did look pretty foolish with the last post about talking with a ref.

Moeder beat Nitcher at the Derby tourny

I never stated that I looked foolish on the last post about approaching an official. I stand behind that statement 100%, it is wrong for any fan or parent to approach an official, that is the coaches job.

Trust me it is easier for you to look foolish than you think... your doing it right now, and don't even know it.

i believe it's time for the grievance committee of the HA club to step in. what will it be fellas? thumb wars? mercy? Indian leg wrestling? you decide, i will ref. btw in any of the above mentioned forms of combat, it is within the grievance committees boundaries to allow OR not allow, swings to the face. open handed or otherwise.

the grievance committee would like to issue a warning to all parties partaking in name calling. this can be hurtful to ones feelings, and psyche...........OH W.T.H if we can't get along...........you know the rest.

take a few deep breaths and get over yourselves. otherwise this could get UGLY.

I went to the top of the totum pole, Chief Ricky Bowden or MR. BOWDEN. He has made our exchange public so if anyone cares to read KSHSAA's take on it shoot me a request. Then you can post it if you want to.

It has been several years since I have posted on these forums, but I still check in from time to time to read up on a few friends that are still in the high school ranks. That being said, I feel compelled to comment here.

I find it absolutely unbelievable that this thread has stretched to 12 pages despite the fact that all of the involved parties seemed to have moved on. Tim and his son have accepted what happened, realized nothing's going to change it at this point and are viewing it as a learning experience. The other wrestler's mother has clearly stated that this was not how her son would have liked to win the match but that she just wants her son to be safe and for competitors to compete in a gracious manner. Without having seen the match myself I feel that both reactions are pretty reasonable and mature ways to handle the situation.

So, for so many people on this board to be so indignant about what happened and to spend so much time complaining about it and the "pussification" of wrestling is absolutely mind-blowing to me. Maybe you all needed a lesson like this when you were younger so that you could heed your own advice to suck it up, take adversity as it comes and move on.

Lastly, I can't believe that so few people have a problem with Mr. Cokeley directly contacting a referee to harrass him about a call he made and then proclaiming a public "tar and feathering" is in order. If that's not over-stepping the bounds of rationality then I don't know what is. Give the guy a break; nobody's perfect and I guarantee you he was not actively trying to "screw" Moeder. I have a hard time believing this particular ref wasn't trying his best to call a fair match and refs in general don't get paid enough to have to deal with that type of BS from fans outside the gym.

It's funny. After reading through this thread I think the board might have been more mature back when I used to post along with Prant and Jhris.

-Mark

Hey Mark! Good to hear from you again.

Cokeley knows the ref and it's not what you think. The public tar and feathering was a joke,(kind of). Certainly the Moeders are taking the high road as I expected they would and all involved are stuck with the result of the match.

However, it is an apathetic stance to suggest that in every situation we should suck it up and move on. That breeds a lack of accountability. Admitting ones mistakes is a cleansing process, improving the chance of not repeating them. As to the "P" issue, it's real and is creeping up on all of us.

About giving the ref a break, I actually like Jeff and think that he's an above average ref. Reviewing film and discussing calls improves his skills. Just saying nobody's perfect and blowing it off is part of the problem.

At the end of the day, we learn. It's all good Mark!

Go Lancers!

Great to hear from you too, Chief. Miss seeing you around on Saturdays...luckily I've been able to catch a bit of wrestling up here from time to time. The benefits of having a D-1 team compete within a 10 minute walk of where you live! Also had a chance to meet up with Baker a few weeks ago. UNO was in town and he was filming for them.

Regarding the ref, if he and Cokeley have a personal relationship then I understand it's different. I was frankly wondering where he got the contact information in the first place.

Regarding the "suck it up and move on" comment, I did not mean to suggest that there should be a lack of accountability. Frankly, that's what's so admirable to me about the Moeders' stances. They disagree with the decision but they also realize that there were certain things done on their end that could have been avoided. Hence they're taking it as a learning experience and, hopefully, growing from it.

With the ref I'm also not saying that he shouldn't be working to improve himself either or be held accountable for a poor call, whether or not he gave it his best effort. Especially in a situation like this where the call was a highly questionable one. I'm all for reviewing past matches, discussing different viewpoints and developing as a ref. In fact I encourage it, because without different viewpoints people certainly become set in their ways and often fail to see things outside of their comfort zone. The same viewpoint can be applied to many things in life, not just here. The issue I had was with the way he was being approached. But, as noted before, that may just be ignorance on my part regarding the relationship between Cokeley and the relevant ref.

Finally, with the "P" issue. I've always erred to the side of "let it go" when it comes to rough wrestling. I haven't seen the tape (video-sharing websites are blocked at my office) but I have a feeling that I would agree with most here that it was a call that shouldn't have been made. I'm just surprised at the fact that there's been so much discussion so far on one case...specifically when the involved parties seem to be over it.

Just my thoughts...slow day at the office after all.

-Mark

The whole point of my protest to the official and KSHSAA as well as to all of the other officials I know, is to make sure FM is ONLY applied as it should be, when something FLAGRANT happens (disgraceful, monstrous, egregious. Flagrant, glaring, gross, outrageous, rank are adjectives suggesting extreme offensiveness)not when there has just been an act of unsportsmanlike conduct or unnecessary roughness. I KNOW that EVERYONE who reads this board would error on the side of allowing the wrestlers to decide the match. Rick could care less about the well being of the student athlete in cases where the official has errored. We have NO officials evaluation system, NO succession plan for officials, NO recourse for those who make mistakes and need more training. In two weeks we have had two glaring misapplications of FM. The student athlete is humiliated and penalized with a loss. The student athlete who works up to 11 months perfecting his skills and stamina sometimes 20 to 25 hours a week and their reward it to have their hand raised. Many of our officials don't spend that much time a year preparing because there is ABSOLUTELY no accountability. The BEST officials are NOT rewarded with the best tournaments and assignments because KSHSAA is so apathetic that they dont have an evaluation or rating system of any make or model. If no one cares enough to complain then there will be no change and thus NO improvement.

The US Education systems have become so imbalanced with liberal policies and lack of male influence that our young men are being emasculated! This is just the tip of the iceberg.

Nice post Will, the kids do work their butts off and to have a ref make a wrong call is unfair. In my boys situation Mr. Bowden showed up to a meet and watched the tape with our AD. The AD informed me that my son did nothing wrong for a FM. The bad thing is the ref wrote pure lies in his report and nothing to this date has been done.

What am I going to do with this truckload of feathers and the 20 gallons of tar? I was gonna use my turkey cooker to heat up the tar, so I didn't bear any additional expense from there. Will, you better be prepared to reimburse me. Next time tell me when you are joking!!!

I think it is emasculating to have all the moms and dads complaining about their kid being treated unfairly by refs who make a perceived bad call. My sons both would have been very upset if either their dad or I got so involved in fighting a battle for them. We are here to advise them and discuss options, but particularly in sports, they deal with the coach, opponents, refs, etc. That is how you teach them to be men. I also think all the use of the “p” word by grown men is pretty juvenile.

I do agree that there should be some procedure for evaluating refs, but this should be approached as an overall performance, not specific calls in one or two matches. I agree with LancerM that we are seeing way too much whining on the forum this season about specific matches and potentially wrong calls by the ref. Until we have instant replay, it really doesn't matter what we think or even see on youtube after the fact.

Before you discount me as just a mom, which in itself is wrong, know that I grew up with 3 brothers, have been married for over 30 years and have raised 2 sons who are doing pretty darn well.

Times were much tougher in the disco era.

Funny, as an older mom, I even pre-date the disco era.

Free love was a tough era also.

Congratulations on a job well done (although your opinion is highly biased! .) I am still doing mine and I didn't criticize your way/methods so give me the same respect. There is a much bigger picture out there than your house. Since your job is done you can respectfully MOVE ON and let us who are still doing ours do it our way. I don't care how many men you have been involved with, you will never know how it feels to become one or be one.


Lou, you are totally wrong about this fight being the kids fight! Heck, parents can't even have a say with the KSHSAA let alone a HS kid!! The battle starts with the school boards but the war is being lost because of gender inequity in the educational system. How dare you accuse me of emasculating my sons! I am teaching them to fight for what they believe in and you should be happy that there are lots of other dads out there over the centuries who have done the same so you can live in the land of the free.


Until there is accountability and an evaluation system there will be more and more bad calls because NOTHING is really being done to improve the system. This forum just might strike up enough interest to get some ideas generated to come up with a plan that can improve and reduce the number of poor officials in big match situations and bad calls that come along with them.

In regards to the word: puss·y 1 5.Slang A man regarded as weak, timid, or unmanly.

not much different than: sissy sis si/ Show Spelled
Pronunciation [sis-ee] Show IPA noun, plural -sies, adjective

Use sissy in a Sentence
See images of sissy
Search sissy on the Web
–noun 1. an effeminate boy or man.
2. a timid or cowardly person.
3. a little girl.

–adjective 4. of, pertaining to, or characteristic of a sissy.

I doubt many have a problem with either word but since you do this is why I prefer the "p" word: Pussification just sounds better than sissification to me.

A typical personal attack, one that I frankly expect anytime someone expresses an opposing opinion. You are way too sensitive and combative. I didn't say anything critical about how you are raising your sons, as I don't know you or your family. I also don't think I bragged about my sons other than to say they are doing well. I could have listed their many accomplishments, but really who cares except family? As for moving on, a parent's job is never over.

Now for the language lesson -

Show Spelled Pronunciation [poos-ee]
–noun, plural -sies. Slang: Vulgar. 1. the vulva.

This word refers to the female anatomy and even the dictionary classifies it as vulgar.

this just got very ugly.

wow, thats all I can say now, wow

I would bet big money that it is used as a slang term way more than it is used in the form you have described. BIG MONEY! It isn't even one of George Carlin's seven deadly words however there is another word on his list that is used pretty exclusively for women that is on that list. It is SO offensive that the general public knows it by a single letter!! Who would have ever thought we would be giving recognition to George Carlin on our Talk Forum...go figure

http://www.erenkrantz.com/Humor/SevenDirtyWords.shtml

A typical personal attack...and yours wasn't???? I think mine was just a witty retaliation/response. Lighten up! Smile!

Will - I really did not intend to single you out. My reference to "parents" was directed toward several who have complained incessantly about their kids getting a raw deal. In fact, I don't think your son has even been mentioned in any of those discussions.

George Carlin is a favorite of mine and I am very familiar with his list of 7 words. Several on that list are in my daily vocabulary. You have to take into account the origin of words even when they are used as slang. For instance, in many business circles it is not appropriate to use Snafu because of its origin. Both of these words referred to in your recent post use the female anatomy as a derogatory label. I just don’t think men need to put women down in order to be masculine. How about saying someone is a dick, weak, or the old wrestling term a fish? I don’t think any fish are going to complain.
By the way, I am smiling. Hope you are, too.

That's the Lou Ann that I know and love! Always a good sport.

great now peta is going to get involved. see lou no matter what name you call someone, somebody- somewhere is going to be offended.

we should have just had a thumb war.

Wow. If someone were to get on here and call a certain kid (using their real name) a fish that would be singling an individual kid out which is totally uncalled for and would be very offensive. To say pussification is talking about society in general and their isn't a thing wrong with it as "we all" as a society are P- ifying every thing by allowing our kids to settle for mediocracy.
Now on another subject Lou. What would your response be to know that there are refs out there that drop the "F" bomb to coaches in front of 8 year old kids. With some of the calls, some of the language and some of the convictions, don't you think it's time for some kind of evaluation system for refs to hold them as accountable as we do the kids and coaches. Most of the refs out there do a great job as do most of the coaches and kids. But just as there are a few coaches and kids who don't (and i have been one of them at times) the refs are the only ones who have no evaluation or penalty system in place. What makes them Gods?

What evaluation system is there for Coaches or Wrestlers? I have seen many Coaches and wrestlers that would not score high enough on an evaluation of knowledge of the rules and sportsmanship to continue on.

And by the way, I have seen the same coaches that are complaining of officials dropping the "F" bomb in front of kids, doing the same thing.

What's an F bomb?

Beeson I have to agree with you on this one...

Patrick,

It's the super naughty word that starts with F.

And it's not fart.

The Bomb just before "G" and right after "E".

You Ark City boys be nice to each other!!

oh..... that bomb. My 12 year old used it when he smashed his thumb with a hammer. I told him it was better then crying!

You have never seen me drop that word during a match in front of the kids. I was however tossed from a tourny for saying BS and they had every right to toss me. Now when a wrestler or coach acts out the evaluation system is they get tossed when a ref does it they get hired by you to officiate their tourny.

HEADUP,

I don't think the committee will approve fishification. Too smelly, what do you think?

but as far as I know I have only ever known of one official to be ejected from a tournament and I have never seen one fired for doing a bad job. The officials have the power but no accountability. They also get paid WAY better than any coach.

Dale, this is not the forum to discuss this as it is the High School forum and not Kids. I will be happy to continue it by PM.

Chad

I have to leave for practice now Chad. You have my number if you would like to discuss this further.

Some of you missed what I stated in my earlier post; I am in favor of an evaluation system for refs. I just think it needs to be approached in a more effective manner than complaining on this forum. Refs should be judged on their body of work, not on one or two matches.

Regarding language: I would say wrestlers are held accountable for their behavior or language by their coaches and parents. Coaches are accountable to the athletic director of their school. Refs should have this same accountability. It is a free market system, and I suppose they are judged by the people who hire them for a tournament. If you host a tournament, don’t hire the ones whose performance you judge to be inferior. I know this doesn’t help when it comes to regionals or state. I wonder what would happen if a kid defaulted a match unless the ref was replaced? I guess the kid would probably lose, but is it worth a try to stand up for what you think is right and to bring about change? I do not know; it is just a question.

As for F bombs and other cussin’ I am not a good one to ask. I really don’t object to much in the way of language. I do see them as just words. I do care a lot more about the message behind the words. I do not like name-calling even if it is “fish”. My earlier point was just that if we are going to denigrate someone, why not use a masculine term? Some of the absolute worst language I have heard is from parents chewing out their son after a lost match and they didn’t use any profanity.

You guys are making me nervous, I'm just gonna plead the 5th on cuss words............

Go eat at the Taco Shop, wait a few hours, and you'll know what an F Bomb is.......

Let it go? Please don't stop now. I am very entertained by most of you. TV sucks! Got no practice tonight. Football is almost over. And I'm in the doghouse for some reason (must be that monthly thing. .or all the cans in the garage maybe).

But please keep it to just a few sentences. Some of you could write a book (I'm not sure it would sell). I graduated (despite what Salyer says) from Iowa State and long posts make me coss-eyed.

Who the hell is June Bug? And why is Beeson always right? Love you all.

This is like walking into a bar fight with a smile on your face after its been going on for 15 minutes and everybody is all worked up.

These are separate points of interest to me, in no particular order.

1. I want to start at the beginning. I'm one of the officials (not THE offical) that worked the North matches. I heard about this situation at lunch shortly after it happened, it seemed pretty straight-forward to me at the time, Wrestler A called Wrestler B a very bad name and then shortly thereafter Wrestler A smacked him upside the head and that was pretty much the end of the match. Then I learned the wrestler that got tossed was 30-0 so I guessed there would be some questions about it. I'm a good guesser. And that's all I'm saying about that topic.

2. This forum is an "open mike." But Kansas registered officials and coaches are, by their agreement with the state association, governed by a Code of Ethics which prohibits public criticism of officials, etc. So if you are an official or coach and you use this forum as a sounding board to express your view on whether an official "blew" a call, you should reread the code, think about it, and make a choice. It's not "wrong" to criticize an official, and you can talk in private, but it is unethical (that's by "rule" not because I say so) to do so in public. It's bad for the sport.

3. Officials make mistakes. Watch the upcoming Super Bowl and you will see what I mean. And those guys are highly paid, professionally trained, experienced, have lots of help, and can use replay. Not one Kansas official I've ever met would deny it.

4. Any evaluation system would have its flaws. Right now, coaches seem to be the evaluators. They hold the cards. Not just because they vote on post-season assignments, but because they can tell the assignors who they want, or don't want, at their tournaments. I have, over the years, seen this happen. A coach once thought I should have awarded his wrestler near fall points and the next year I was not invited back to his tournament. So there are consequences even if the coach was wrong. No appeal for officials either. And there is a "self-governing" system. The assignors learn who can handle the tough matches and who come up short. It's like the army, you don't get promoted to sargeant unless you can handle being a private.

5. In my opinion, this area of the state is blessed with a strong core of well-respected, dedicated, and knowledgeable officials. I don't count myself in their ranks, but I have been in their company enough to know that their only desire is to make the right calls. And when they are together they are talking wrestling, officiating, and tough calls. And they are all good people. Except for Bob Ford.

6. It's not just coaches and wrestlers that put in time. On a typical Saturday an official will spend 8+ hours on the mat in constant action. My guess is that in a relatively few years an official would log more hours on a mat than any high school wrestler did during his four years in school. Everybody involved in wrestling puts in time. I don't know that, as a "money maker," the pay is worth it for either coaches or officials. JV officials didn't get a raise for about 10 years in a row.

7. Wrestling, as a high school sport, has some issues. I've seen the crowds dwindle to the point where I feel bad for the wrestlers. I'm not sure some even have a parent in the stands. Rarely see cheerleaders. It's a tough sport to be involved in as a kid. Lots of "easier" options. It's great if you are a four year letter winner, 34-0, and it's your life. That's the top 1% but there's a whole lot of kids that don't enjoy that success. At the same time, "sportsmanship" seems to be on the decline. Mixed martial arts, profanity, disrespect, and general "bad" attitude problems are increasing. Fans and parent incidents, including violence, are reported regularly. And as we see too often, officials are brow beaten for a "bad" call even when that call was correct. Example, last weekend a dad was filming near matside and when his kid got turned with a perfectly legal figure-four of the head he was screaming "that's illegal, that's a scissors, you've got to stop that!!"

8. It is becoming increasingly difficult to recruit and keep good coaches and officials. I have seen almost a 100% turnover in coaches in the past 15 years. It is becoming more difficult to find a sufficient number of qualified officials for regionals each year.

9. And lastly, I wish I'd taken a few more college courses so I could figure out why so many people seem to think it is OK to launch a nasty, personal, hateful, and ugly attack over a topic that is supposed to be "for sport." I was thinking about posting on this forum on the way home tonight from work while listening to "talk radio" and thought how similar some of the rabid caller's comments were to what often goes on here....

either way smells fishy to me! anyway beeson is the pres. he should come up with the motto. i think lou ann belong in the club. she sounds like a HA just like my wife.

The right to have an opinion is not accompanied by the right to be taken seriously.

This has become the most bazaar post I have ever read. Yet, like a train wreck, I can't take my eyes off it.

To recap:

A question was asked as to who is still undefeated
Several were mentioned
Perhaps the best pound for pound wrestler in the state lost by DQ
The wrestler may or may not have committed a flagrant misconduct penalty.
The dad and wrestler accepted full responsibility, regardless, and moved onto better things
The St. James haters started fanning the flames
The referee’s application of the rule was called into question
Salyer pulled out the rule book
It was determined that no one was using tobacco products
Discussion over the interpretation of the rule ensued
Videos were posted
People directly involved in the situation added addition information
St. James fell out of the top three at SMNW, some were happy about this
Tate Omli is undefeated
People feel that too many refs settle the match instead of the kids
Chief quoted Wes Fessler (who dat?)
“cs” is referenced – dwelsh is confused
The dad and wrestler again accepted full responsibility, regardless, and moved onto better things
The refs allow western Kansas kids to be rougher, still not as rough as Pennsylvania
St. James is called out
The dad and wrestler once again accepted full responsibility, regardless, and moved onto better things
People don’t like winning programs, especially private Catholic ones who must cheat
The “grassy knoll” video is posted
More debate ensues
Coakley opens the debate about the pussification of wrestling
Tripods are encouraged for all future meets
LancerM chimes in after a long hiatus
A serious argument for an officials rating system is made
Tar and feathers are put on hold
Liberal schools and too many female teachers have emasculated our youth
Mom chimes in and says this is not so
Coakley goes after mom, but both are smiling afterwards
Memories of the 60’s & 70’s are called to mind
A dictionary reference clears everything up
Or does it?
A direct link is provided for all visitors to become familiar with the “seven dirty words”
PETA is involved because of the use of the word “fish”
The F-bomb is dropped at a kids tournament (is this news?)
“fishification” is coined – deemed too smelly
A Taco Shop reference is made
Akin is in the dog house; June Bug’s identity is demanded
Defref earns his PhD after defending his dissertation
And by the way

There is one God, but many gods; at least that is what I tell my students, because I can

Great discussion, just keep away from the personal attacks and I commend those of you who post your names.

Please don't start a religious discussion, it will only end with about as much resolution as this one.

Ha! Good one.

But come on man, I was only confused on the 'cs' thing for about 5 minutes. I figured it all out on my own as the next post clearly shows. Give credit where credit is do! ;-)

Dean Welsh
Educator/Wrestling Fan/Former Coach

Uh, ............yeah, ............ that about sums it up. Actually, that was an excellent summation of the events on this post!

Nice job on the simple outline. Very funny!

We should end the thread on Bill's classic post!

I commend Mr. Moeder for the class he has shown in his posts.
Sometimes we need to know when its better just to keep our fingers off the keyboard.

it just got ugly AGAIN!

No doubt.

Mr. Dewitt:

Very funny...and I hope it makes us all laugh at ourselves at least a little....

Now that is a long post worth reading. Hats off!

I figured DeWitt would have caught this, but I guess the air in the adminstrator's office is getting thin.

I really hate it when a post defiantly gets classless. It's definitely a problem.



"Getting on this forum and wildly speculating that it must be the other kids fault is what I would call CS, and defiantly the most classless post I have seen on this forum, and that’s really saying something!"

post of the year! followed by akin's post. those aren't soda cans in the garage, are they?

While we are handing out awards...This is my nomination for tagline of the year:
Jerry Dale "Dale 3:16- thou shall not ref if thou are a convict "

I sure wish I would of had this group defending my ticket for not coming to a complete stop at a stop sign.
Truth of the matter is, that rules and laws are set up for the benefit of the sport or society, and we must be held accoutable not the cop, or the ref, if the infraction actually did occur.
I was not pleased with the outcome of my ticket, but now pay closer attention.

Best Display Name, The award goes to : Tigersgirl

I implied that because I heard what was going on. But only from one side. BUt I am guilty of not asking the other side if that was true. I will delete that portion of my post.

I still say it is completely out of character for Taylor to do something like this, hence, I believe, circumstantial evidence that something tripped his trigger.

I am only asking a question here, but do you think Taylor was unprovoked? Let's not tar and feather me for what is, in my opinion, a valid question.

Let's go back to my junior year in football. We were playing Maize, and they had a running back that was a freight train. For whatever reason, they ran a play where he did NOT get the ball. He faKed around to my side, play went the other way. As I was running to the other side of the field, one of my teammates had tackled this running back, without the ball, and was on top of him punching him. As the play was whistled dead on the other side of the field, one of the officials turned to see the action behind him. By that time, the Burlington NOrthern freight train had turned the tide, and was on top of my teammate, throwing haymakers, while my team mate had his arms out like "what is he doing??!!". (this all happened in a matter of seconds of course) This resulted in the the Chattanooga Choo Choo being tossed from the game, and allowed us an opportunity, which wasn't there as he was running for 10-12 yards per carry) to beat them. (which we blew with a roughing the kicker call late in the game that gave them another opportunity for a chip shot field goal to beat us)

Point is this. If he was provoked, he overreacted, but the other wrestler should admit it so that both parties can take some blame. And if Taylor wasn't provoked, shame on him for hurting himself and his team.

First of all I would like to thank the academy, my family, my friends and Mr. Matt Collins who wrote and produced and came up with most of the tag line.

You know, maybe I have been too easy on these Officials. I am starting to see the other side of it. I have a great proposal on how to evaluate officials. Any official that makes a questionable call should be immediately stripped of his stripes. Then after all officials have been banned, have the coaches officiate the matches. This will automatically implement a policy on how to evaluate coaches. Same rule applies, questionable call, GONE. Once we have weeded out all of the Officials and Coaches, then we can have the people officiate who truly understand how to call a match, the fans and parents. I'm sure this would solve all controversy concerning questionable calls. Headup, get ready for some Grievences.

That wasn't nearly as funny as Bill's post.........

When we run out of coaches and officials we can use the patrons at Buffalo Wild Wings to make all of the calls via instant replay.

It wasn't meant to be funny, I was serious. I truly believe that is how some on this forum think.

i'm going to need some more boxing gloves, if you implement that new policy. what if the parents and fans are wrong? is that possible? do they have to leave?

i don't think rock, scissor, paper will work, anymore.

better yet we can do like in bloodsport... wrap the hands, then soak in wax, and dip them into broken glass. who would win cokeley, van damme, or cung le? that would change some peoples views in a hurry.

i think we need Chuck Norris to ref all matches, Chuck Norris doesn't make mistakes, it's true, ask him he'll tell you. if you still don't believe him, he will crush you with his bare hands. it worked for average joe's it should work for us. if we truly want to be HA, we need an HA REF!!

Out of Curiosity, and because I seem to be the President Elect, what does HA stand for?

I edited one of my post from yesterday because it wasn't entirely fair to Beeson. Sorry Chad.

I may have thrown you under the bus a little also, my apologies. Love ya man.

Man crush?? Did you guys have to share a bed back when you were both AC Bulldawgs? I know many on here have wondered but no one had the guts to ask!

Believe it or not Jerry was out of High School and Coaching me in 7th and 8th grade. That has got to make him at least as old as Cokeley or Eck.

i thought you and Salyer were running the show Chad. you said you were going state wide. i wasn't sure either but thought that it might rhymn with card and bass. i dunno, i just like to see disputes settled, by some form of competition.

If that is what it stands for, and I believe it does, I will be more than Happy to accept the position of President. Let the membership drive begin. I can think of several that would make great members. HA!

If he was coaching you I am hoping there was no bed sharing going on but I know how you AC boys roll!

I am older than Mr. Dale. Go back to the Les Miller, Greg Gross, Darren Dalton, Barry Anstine days to find my age group.

The Elite Members of the honerary order of Extreme HA.

I like it. I want to be treasurer. I got some tips from Henry Gallet.

we always settled disputes that way since we were kids, then that mentallity carried over to our wrestling. i know some HA here in SEK for sure.

don't sell us HAs out just yet cokeley, you may be too old (admittedly) to be an "active" member,lol, but your tenacity will be held in high regard. i know the school system and society are against us, but we won't let anyone "-ify" our kids in anyway.

you would probably make a good vice president, though, i mean let beeson smile and kiss babies, while you do all the dirty work. just let me be incharge of the grievance committee.

TWO MEN ENTER.... ONE MAN LEAVES!!!

After this morning's flurry, I had to go back to Mr. DeWitt's post to figure out which "-ify" we were on now. Thanks to his post, I was able to get back on track quickly and determined that we weren't going to use fishify or fishification due to their odiferous origin.

i meant -ify in ANYWAY, p----ify, fishify, sissify, classify, disqualify, you get the hint.

Rectify, gratify, justify, quantify, purify, ratify ........ I'm with you now, I'm on board.

That explains it, Jerry Dale was your y outh coach..............

Now that's good stuff....

What is this. You apologize then throw me right back under the bus. That's kind of low Chad.

You guys have found a way to finally put an end to this thread! If this juvenile back and forth posting of pointless one liners doesn’t kill it, nothing will. Thank you

All the posts after Bill's need to deleted.

Chief,

I agree. That was a classic post by Mr. DeWitt. I give permission to have all of my posts deleted after his, including this one.

i think the only one's worth keeping are from mr. moeder. delete the rest.

Dylon Walker @ 189 from ElDorado is still unbeaten.

Gotta agree with Mr. Cokeley

285
1. BJ Finney - 12 - AN - 4A
2. Tank Burns - 12 - COL - 4A
3. Trey Page - 12 - WNW - 6A
4. Lorenzo Serna - 12 - EMP - 5A
5. Jared Rice - 12 - PHI - 321A
6. Cody Huffman - 12 - DOU - 321A
7. Dillon Salmans - 11 - HOX - 321A
8. Beau Bennett - 12 - PT - 5A
9. Luke Henning - 11 - AUG - 4A
10. Damone Hatch - 12 - IND - 4A


WHO IS STILL UNBEATEN I KNOW JERED RICE IS BUT IS ANYONE ELSE

I believe BJ Finney is still undeafeated. Correct me if I am wrong.

He is undefeated.