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Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Just Wondering] #226819 03/03/14 04:11 AM
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Cokeley Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Just Wondering
can someone enlighten me to the issue that happened in 6A, i believe it was 152 lb class, Action was stopped for almost 30 min and appeared they had head offical involved and lots of debate about outcome. thanks


I saw the end of this match. CLEARLY the Manhattan wrestler had achieved an escape and there was one second left on the clock. This was the problem, and the same official was assisting in the 182 5A finals committing the same error. The assistance official MUST be watching the clock at the end of the period as the official on the whistle is focused on the action. The assistant SHOULD count down so the whistle KNOWS when time has expired and there is no guess work or conference. In both of these matches errors were committed denying the wrestlers the opportunity to decide the match in the next OT period. Everyone makes mistakes but it appeared to me that most of the time, even some of the veterans, either didn't have a clue how to assist or they were too engulfed in watching the action, or they were just too lazy to watch the clock tick down to ASSIST the official on the whistle. When you have TWO officials the table nor towel tapper should EVER be involved in a decision about scoring. I personally believe there should be NO towel tapper when a assistant is being utilized.

The worst calls of the weekend, in my opinion were the stalling calls in the 126lb 5A semis. With 30 seconds left in the match and no one initiating a shot an official should NEVER call a stall to break a one-one tie. EMBARASSING to the sport. Let them wrestle and decide by scoring. This official seemed generally clueless all weekend as I witnessed him arguing with his assistant on a near fall situation stopped for bleeding. He only wanted to award two points... ANY official working a state tournament should know that you get an additional point when blood time is called. He finally acquiesced so this wrestler was not a victim of ineptitude.

It is the EASIEST sport in high school to officiate. Focus on two competitors inside of a circle for six minutes. The rule book is very short in length and very easy to understand especially if you have been a competitor.

I do agree with Beeson that overall the officiating was adequate but I also agree with Jerry Dale as I never saw a coach get a call overturned ALL weekend. I saw the end of the 6A 145 and the official on the whistle clearly counted as it was NOT a rocking nearfall situation. It was a high flier strait to the back. 2 reversal and at LEAST 2 nearfall should have been awarded. He counted for Pete's sake and the wrestler was FLAT on his back. The outside seem to have little to contribute... SAD for OLN as this call cost them an individual champ and a team trophy.


Will Cokeley
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Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Cokeley] #226833 03/03/14 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted By: Cokeley

The assistance official MUST be watching the clock at the end of the period as the official on the whistle is focused on the action. The assistant SHOULD count down so the whistle KNOWS when time has expired and there is no guess work or conference......When you have TWO officials the table nor towel tapper should EVER be involved in a decision about scoring. I personally believe there should be NO towel tapper when a assistant is being utilized.


Not looking to argue, just offering another point of view. There is a fine line between the assist focusing on counting down and trying to keep an eye on the action. I used to officiate I had a situation a several years ago at a regional where I was the assist and was counting down for my head official. The position of the clock for the mat was at the top of the gym. At the time I felt the same way you do about assists must count down. But while I was counting down on the clock and took my eyes off the action (which you have to do) and the wrestlers were in a scramble. I felt that I should count down so my head official would know exactly when time was up so he knew if points should be awarded. I believe the score was tied at the time and this was at the end of regulation. Sure enough, while I'm glancing at the clock to and back at the action a wrestler apparently grabbed his opponents singlet. It was on the back side from the head official so he couldn't see it, but I should have if I wasn't counting down the clock. This 1-point would have won the match. The coach took the head official to the table and knew that I was the one in position to make the call, my head official asked me and I told him exactly what I just typed. The match went to OT and the kid who would have gotten the penalty point ended up losing. The coach pointed directly at me and told me quote, "You're the reason my kid lost!"

Since then I have only counted down clock when it is visually feasible for me to do so with my eyes spending more time on the action than the clock. This isn't the only situation you could have with an assist watching the clock. He could miss a locked hands, he could miss potential changes in control or when they occurred at the end of a period. If an official is stuck counting down the clock it is inevitable that he will be needed at some point in those waning seconds and he will have left his head official out to dry even though he is performing the mechanic correctly.

I think for that reason you NEED to have a tapper still with the assist out there. Just my 2-cents.

Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Ref] #226836 03/03/14 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: Ref
Originally Posted By: Cokeley

The assistance official MUST be watching the clock at the end of the period as the official on the whistle is focused on the action. The assistant SHOULD count down so the whistle KNOWS when time has expired and there is no guess work or conference......When you have TWO officials the table nor towel tapper should EVER be involved in a decision about scoring. I personally believe there should be NO towel tapper when a assistant is being utilized.


Not looking to argue, just offering another point of view. There is a fine line between the assist focusing on counting down and trying to keep an eye on the action. I used to officiate I had a situation a several years ago at a regional where I was the assist and was counting down for my head official. The position of the clock for the mat was at the top of the gym. At the time I felt the same way you do about assists must count down. But while I was counting down on the clock and took my eyes off the action (which you have to do) and the wrestlers were in a scramble. I felt that I should count down so my head official would know exactly when time was up so he knew if points should be awarded. I believe the score was tied at the time and this was at the end of regulation. Sure enough, while I'm glancing at the clock to and back at the action a wrestler apparently grabbed his opponents singlet. It was on the back side from the head official so he couldn't see it, but I should have if I wasn't counting down the clock. This 1-point would have won the match. The coach took the head official to the table and knew that I was the one in position to make the call, my head official asked me and I told him exactly what I just typed. The match went to OT and the kid who would have gotten the penalty point ended up losing. The coach pointed directly at me and told me quote, "You're the reason my kid lost!"

Since then I have only counted down clock when it is visually feasible for me to do so with my eyes spending more time on the action than the clock. This isn't the only situation you could have with an assist watching the clock. He could miss a locked hands, he could miss potential changes in control or when they occurred at the end of a period. If an official is stuck counting down the clock it is inevitable that he will be needed at some point in those waning seconds and he will have left his head official out to dry even though he is performing the mechanic correctly.

I think for that reason you NEED to have a tapper still with the assist out there. Just my 2-cents.


95% of the matches during the year are officiated with just one set of eyes. There will be FAR more errors made on time than calls during the action. Officials are the ONLY paid professionals on the mat. Don't place the decision on a 12 year old kid or some volunteer table workers. In the last 10 seconds leave the action to the whistle and make sure the time is properly started and the scoring is properly ended. You have to either look at it from the greater good perspective or get a THIRD official to manage time. A volunteer or youth should NEVER EVER be placed in a situation where the match or scoring outcome hinges on their judgment.

Not arguing either, constructive debate and an attempt to make sense. Your thoughts?

Last edited by Cokeley; 03/03/14 02:55 PM.

Will Cokeley
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Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Cokeley] #226841 03/03/14 03:33 PM
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I understand your point-of-view but I just gave a real situation in which counting down the clock adversely effected the outcome of the match. The main point of the assistant is to be able to see those calls that happen away from the head official, or offer an opinion on a call if the head coach or head official requests it. Yes counting down the clock is also part of his duty.

I'm just saying it would be nice to definitively say the assist MUST count down but there are situations where it would be more pertinent for the official to keep his eye on the action rather than count the clock. I'm pretty sure the coach of the kid that lost the match I talked about would have the opposite opinion of yours. But to be honest, this is something my opinion waivered on when I was officiating. Do I only count or do I count when visually feasible to not distract from the action on the mat? Because I was burned.

Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Ref] #226842 03/03/14 03:42 PM
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Cokeley Offline OP
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You weren't burned. The lead was burned because he wasn't in position to see the grasp. Again, I think there is NO WAY to catch everything so you have to prevent the problems that occur the most frequently.


Will Cokeley
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Re: Taboo Topic...Poor quality of officiating [Re: Ref] #226846 03/03/14 04:09 PM
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Tip of the day...you can do both--count down and watch the action. At our supervisor's meeting this year we went over some mechanics on how to position yourself so that you could watch the action while having the clock in your field of vision. That applies without an assistant and it was a good technique. It puts you in a better position to know the time through-out the match and still keeps you in good position most of the time to see both the action and the clock. So there's no confusion, you don't sacrifice good positioning to keep an eye on the clock, you just position yourself as often as possible so that you can keep the clock in front of you. Generally, clock watching, by either the official or the wrestler is bad form....

With an assistant, the assistant does not need to be staring at the clock for the last ten seconds...most officials will have a system...the asst. will call out "10" and give a verbal count, if at all, from 4 down to "time."

As an assistant, there's no reason to stare at the clock once you confirm you are at four seconds, you can watch the action and count down in your head, which is what the head official ought to be doing as well as soon as he hears "4"...when you hit "1" in your head, glance up for a last, split-second, confirmation, if you must, that you are still in sync and yell "time."

That also works when you are working alone and realize the towel tapper is texting or chatting and won't be there to help you. Just grab a look at the clock in the last 10 seconds and count yourself down to zero without looking at the clock. EZ.

We are supposed to practice our NF counting so we get that right and not give points too quickly or slowly. There's no reason an assistant can't accurately count down the last four seconds without relying upon a visual of the clock for every last second.

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