If you are already in the Turk you can take the ankle towards the head or pin it under his butt (I believe that's what you are referring to). This can become potentially dangerous or even unnecessary roughness if the official believes you're only using it to inflict pain. From the top position (without a Turk in place) the back bow is illegal upon application. Our area supervisor believes this is when you pull up on the ankle. I haven't seen in a NFHS case or rule book anything about "when the knee comes off the mat." I did find a video that used that terminology on a Texas wrestling thread but again I've never seen or heard it from our national board. Great topic to take to Mr. Lentz for confirmation. I think I'll do the same.

Tim M. Horgan